MH-EscapeFromNaZaliBeta1

[TexasGtar]

I don't know how you guys figured that out

Very simple: binary search.
......

Google what binary search is.

I just Googled it.
And that is so far over my head I can't even see it.
I am just a carpenter, I shouldn't even know how to build a map.

I'll take your word for it that it can be done and you know how to do that and it sure came in handy and was helpful tonight.
I know how to cut a board in half. That's about it.
Thanks for the explanation though. I'll watch some youtube videos.
Maybe I can get a little smarter on it.

=======================================================================================
UPDATE::

Nali Priest must be indestructible or this map can not be used in most MH servers.

Or make second way for pass map without Priest.

Door 3, opened by Priest move two statues placed near.

Tentacle18 placed in void and can not be killed.

All other things except Nali I kill with BShock. So this map can be passed. Not sure about weapons and monster count and strength. Also not sure by time limit for Priest.

What do box with sticks? Call Priest to actions?

Buttons messages and all Mission Recap must be embed in map as CriticalEvent messages.

I will make a special map for MH servers where the Nali is expendable. The challenge is to protect the Nali in this version. Other version will be straight up monster hunt team play. Escape the fortress. So yes, that is in the works.

The statues, yup. lol I moved them out from the wall. Good catch.

Tentacle 18 back in map ready for action.

Weapons you get everything but redeamer. In the order you can get...
Pistol, flak, minigun, 8-ball, ripper, pulse, sniper, bio, shock. Not sure that was what you meant about weapons.
I've killed 850 monsters before and I don't think that was all of them. Not sure exact count. Monster strength I have adjusted I am sure on some monsters. Not sure what you are asking here.

The time limit is frustrating. It took me so many runs to get the timing down. The Priest doesn't care what you do. He moves through his patrol points and pauses at them. I've tweaked the timing so as to not make you wait too long but to give you time to go back and reup on health,ammo,armor. I wish there was a way I could get him to wait until triggered, but he has a tag and I have triggered it to get him to start. Not sure
how to do it but just hope the timing is doable but not too long to make you wait for him to move. I think he may be too fast the first few runs until you get the "feel" of the layout and what's coming. It's not a perfect system but I have gotten him through the end many times. It isn't easy even for me. It's supposed to be difficult.
I don't want to make it too hard either. I may need to adjust the timing some more.

Box with sticks are for the multi player version so player can open door. I'll remove them in this version so they are not confusing. I was using them to test in case the Nali got killed I could still check out the other areas behind the doors.

Not sure how to do a 'critical message' but I'll dig around.
Plan is to have objective screenshots like an assault map. I think it is a F3 while you are playing? Can't remember how to do those. I'll look at my assault map I know has them and see if I can figure out how to make that too.

DOM-Dragonphile -?

DOM-LP-Dragonphile released November 2006 according to map's readme.

This was a inside of a spaceship map. Not very good.
I'll upload it if you want to see it. Let me know. It might be on Shrimps archive.

Tried to play, since I have a clean installation of UT, could provide a new download link with all files included? It won't start without the files.

Thanks!

1000 apologies. I am getting it together for Beta3 very soon. With ALL the packages this time!!!! Thank you for your time. Again, I apologize.

Okay, so first bust outta jail...

...then fight thru various threats...

...and then no clue what to do next.

This was annoying:

Turns out there's a SkaarjSniper around there somewhere, who has the actual UT sniper rifle, so it made up for that a bit, but U1 weapons shouldn't be in ut99... exception of the Dispersion Pistol.

I thought was doing pretty well, until my backup killed the Priest...

...but even before that I had no idea where to go next.

Other things:

· Typically the shock rifle works better against flies than the flak cannon.
· There's other MH maps where they use a Mercenary to guide players along, and I don't believe that Merc is killable. Something to look into.

I'll draw arrows on the floor so you'll know where to go.
I will make objective screenshots, That should help the what to do next issue.
The rest is an adventure. Explore, shoot, explore.

I have replaced the unreal weapons with ut sniper rifles and now the snipers are deadly in the dock area. Way tougher now to get through.

I agree the shock rifle would take out all the flies in one shot. And no way I'm giving you the shock rifle first. You have to earn that. lol That gun is just too powerful.
I am increasing the fly spawn time due to popular demand so the flies won't be so bad right off the bat.

A mercenary. Hmmm. And the bots don't shoot at the mercenary?

Hey if you got the Nali to the docks with a bot, that is amazing. I can't do that.
You must have nicer bots than me because as soon as the nali's cell door opens the Nali is toast with my bots. How did you keep the bot from shooting the Nali all the way to the docks? Just amazing!
So yeah, you WERE doing pretty well.
=====================================================================

As for mapping:
You can remove all MonsterWayPoints repeating Position 1 for no purpose (Any MH Bot Pathing tutorial ? ) - will help in making map smaller. MonsterWayPoint has as Position 1 a single time then Position 2 then whatever, even Position 100. Then how goes with Jumps ? Bot won't jump that much in MH because is not having a good ImpactHammer - some mutators are accelerating damage and then... Bot dies. How about some swJumpPad design ? It causes less reachSpecs and guaranteed jumping.
Then...

Code: Select all

MaxNumFound: I found 7083 reachspecs, from 0 to 7082.
WarnDist: 59 reachSpecs have nodes claimed too close.

I think you can forget DevPath (I'm hoping to wrong) here... find a "Pathing Monster".
Worth so many items since respawntime can be adjusted ? Those from upper spots are only generating paths for no purpose, you can complete more ammo AFTER pathing... and so on.

Does the "Flag0" actor follows the boat ? By looking at setup I'm not sure about that.
Edit: Ahah, now I see the mover, it was a mix of AttachTag like attaching to itself, lol.

More PathNodes are in water... I think some Bots will get drowned.
And these combos...
Why not having a normal distance ? Under 400 UU.

All right I need some rest today...

A monster hunt pathing tutorial would be good. I just plopped Monsterwaypoints around.
I don't know how they work.

The bots are jumping okay for me. Are you talking about the jump to upper hallway?
If they aren't working good I will consider putting in jump pads.

59 too close. Okay i'll see what i can do about those.

You don't like my flak ammo shelves? My wife told me to put some shelves in that room. Then she immediately filled them up with flak ammo. lol

I will be removing a lot of the over ammo/guns in this single player map. There really doesn't need to be any pathing in a single player map (theoretically) but the multi player one will need good pathing, Better than what is in this one so i will make adjustments.

Yes flag and upside down candle stick are attached to the boat.

Path nodes in water need to be raised. I had a couple bots drown during my bot tests.

I'll look at those lift exits and center paths. Thanks for the screenshot. Didn't
know about the 400uu rule.

=========================================================================

Technically we were under the docks at that point.

One of my bots floated away on that boat...

Dude you are too funny. Kudos.

=======================================================================

So, you can kill it. Message appear for any death Priest. Even if this death not block map.

Boat can return back if slith appear on boat way.
And you can swim by water as mentioned above.

------
Sniper located at flame near one tower down entrance.

Answered this already but going in order so answering again....
I need to change the death message to something more correct.
Boat movers are set to return when encroached.

===================================================================

(though I'm still not convinced about that number of flies at the start ).

If you want this version to be played as a SP map then, to make this clear, I would suggest removing all but one PlayerStart and the botpathing, and use the SP prefix rather than MH.

For the multi-player MH version you'll need more onscreen messages indicating what people should do/where they should go, bearing in mind that it will be played by people who don't have access to the readme (but you'll be aware of that).

I didn't even know there was a SP prefix. Makes sense.

More messages. Yes. Good idea.

Fly problem addressed.
=====================================================================

I do not press last button. So boat simple goes via closed mover. I do not want try my luck, so I stay on edge and wall push me in the water. No collision occurs, so nothing stop boat from hide behind closed mover.

Priest want jump in middle boat and slowly travel across towers.

I'll look into that boat going through the closed opening. Boat should return when encroached.

Yes the Priest takes the slow boat. lololol I have sped his boat up some. It took me forever to get him to the boat the first time. When I finally did , it was an "O Happy Day" moment. Lots of testing. Still tweaking Nalis boat speed timing.

=================================================================

Next:
NaliPriest - the mostly is chickening around and saying a pray on knees and... it doesn't do any patrolling, but I see it running away following paths. On-line with those movers in plain UT I'm not sure if it would work as should. However, you don't need that Nali in a raw MonsterHunt version because you can GRAB door or else map goes broken as long as Nali it's not like it's your best friend - like I said, when game starts MonsterHunt will set AttitudeToPlayer = ATTITUDE_Hate and others even ATTITUDE_Frenzy = Insanity. I think Nali should have an ALARM instead of PATROL. Monster in alarm have fear of player and might follow Alarms even using a HomeBase.
Anyway I wanna know how goes compressing such map for ON-Line, then we can discuss about the rest of needs...

If the Nali is chickening he has been frightened. I have actually stood in front of him and got him to back up all the way to the door triggers one time. It was a hassle though. If the Nali is running he has been shot or really frightened.

The single player map is not really for online play.

Bots can open the Nali only doors. I've seen them do it.
And yes, the Nali is a total pain in the you know what. That is kinda the challenge
to see if you can get him out while he gets you out.

I'm not sure how alarm works. I don't think that would be good. I don't want the nali to be afraid. He won't act right when he is scared. Worth looking into though.

[OjitroC]

...The time limit is frustrating. It took me so many runs to get the timing down. The Priest doesn't care what you do. He moves through his patrol points and pauses at them. I've tweaked the timing so as to not make you wait too long but to give you time to go back and reup on health,ammo,armor....

I'm sure you will but there needs to be some explanation of the time limit in the readme - I wasn't aware of it (not that I've got to that part yet) but it may have an effect on how I play as I normally take things pretty slowly, don't rush and have a look around.

I do have DOM-LP-Dragonphile - thanks for the offer.

[sektor2111]

What does it do MonsterWayPoint is described in MONSTERHUNT package in a htm Help file, it's not like you have to drop them like PathNodes without doing settings. Good MonsterHunt tutorials are explaining what's about, else Shrimp is here, ask him for that help file.

Yes flag and upside down candle stick are attached to the boat.

Try a simple LAN server and see what you get there... Nothing, trust me, client won't see any candle... Those are net borks that can be avoided by using other non-static actors with a mesh changed and not running animations, simple as that.

=========================================================================

EvilGrins wrote: ↑
Wed Jul 15, 2020 9:06 pm

Technically we were under the docks at that point.

One of my bots floated away on that boat...

Dude you are too funny. Kudos.

=======================================================================

EG is funny but that's because you have done impossible paths. Combos LE-LC-LE are two-way things. As example Path going from LiftExit42 to JumpSpot14, I don't want to be a poor Bot in that moment... I can even see what reachSpec has no purpose here.

Code: Select all

....
Specs: LiftExit42 - Paths[1]=2514 ->LiftExit42 --->JumpSpot14 RFlags=Special =32 Dist=500
Connected: LiftExit42 to JumpSpot14.
....

Even in real life you cannot follow such paths - forget these.
Because Boat it's Mover you can consider it a Lift. Add Entry (LiftExit) on the deck, center (LiftCenter) on boat - following boat as any normal LiftCenter does and... Exit must be checked where has to be placed for not causing a Way-Back because it's not what we need. This Exit can be connected with water nodes heading to that upper whatever bridge (nothing to MonsterEnd is even needed as Lift Combination) and... we don't need any jump there as long as ground-water paths are available. By any matter, aerial MonsterWaypoints have no purpose and they will never be reachable, forget them too. Behind that last door, all Pawn can follow swimming to the END which must be... lowered for being reachable else don't expect more action from Bots except those delegated with covering human hunter. If they don't jump from boat nearby LiftExit behind last Door, drop a kicker on the way and here can be simulated a "jump-off boat", solutions are a lot and very logic solutions. And I REPEAT, All Ammo paths generators can be added later. You can save them elsewhere in a TXT file, build paths in map and PASTE AMMO back, AFTER pathing. It's a simple operating task, nothing complicated preventing a high paths load which have no purpose and no use.

To me these might happen if that NaliPriest will do the right thing - or leaving hunters to attack buttons and levers instead of that stupid six members mooing creature. In MonsterHunt servers there might be 90% chances for being killed by a "bonus" redeemer or whatever cheats or various MH adds, don't count on any Nali, just count on hunting Monsters, and yes I like first area, it's not like those flies can kill me in plain MonsterHunt. Skaarj has a chance but... not a lot... It's entertaining, similar to my MH-BattlingLottery map...

But... you don't need to have everything solved, probably Barbie will solve these in future, then I can have what paths I want and all settings, and then we can have a completely usable MH map for everyone - trust me, admins are using everything, the excuse with SP has no deal when a map has MH as prefix and you should be aware of that.

[Buggie]

Boat should return when encroached.

It is mean collision between Actor and Mover when Actor can not be shifted by Mover.
It is does not mean any collision between Brush and Mover. They always ghost for each other.
Mover never collide with Brush and vice versa.
This is how door usually works - its hide inside wall. No any collision occur.
So you need something other if you not want make boat going inside closed door before mh end.

Priest timer id ridiculous thing. People is very different. Which for someone is fast, for another person is slow. So "perfect timing" simply does not exist.

[Barbie]

Does anyone know about these packages and if they are a stock sound package?

If you have installed UnrealDeps, look into its sub directory "UT99". There you'll find "KnownFiles_UT99.ufl" that contains the names of all stock files. The UFL file consists of plain text and can be opened by a any text editor.

Is there any way to find a texture on a hidden surface????

(Questionmark attack - see my signature )
Export the map to T3D, open that file with a text editor and use its search function to find the name of the texture. Example for Texture=CasWAL:

Code: Select all

Begin Actor Class=Brush Name=Brush109
    CsgOper=CSG_Subtract
    MainScale=(SheerAxis=SHEER_ZX)
    PostScale=(SheerAxis=SHEER_ZX)
    Level=LevelInfo'MyLevel.LevelInfo0'
    Tag=Brush
    Region=(Zone=LevelInfo'MyLevel.LevelInfo0',iLeaf=2359,ZoneNumber=15)
    Location=(X=832.000000,Y=-251.000000,Z=416.000000)
    OldLocation=(X=1696.000000,Y=-224.000000,Z=384.000000)
    Begin Brush Name=Model113
       Begin PolyList
          Begin Polygon Texture=CasWAL Flags=8388608 Link=0
             Origin   -00256.000000,-00004.000000,-00128.000000
             Normal   -00001.000000,+00000.000000,+00000.000000
             TextureU +00000.000000,+00001.000000,+00000.000000

[EvilGrins]

I'll draw arrows on the floor so you'll know where to go.

I've said numerous times that some maps could really do with signs. There's a number of CTF maps that have arrows drawn on the walls and floors if the map is large enough that it's that confusing.

MH could certainly use that, along the lines of an arrow sign that says "Thataway" or something.

[TexasGtar]

UPDATE: Hey everyone. Thanks again for all the help.
I have remade the cell doors and map is still under 10mb's. I am doing fixes as suggested and will upload new and improved beta3 very soon. Maybe tonight.

I have all the package issues resolved with OjitroC's help and Barbies tool.

@evilgrins...I'm serious about those arrows on the floor! lol

[EvilGrins]

@evilgrins...I'm serious about those arrows on the floor!

So was I.

[Barbie]

The skybox texture looks quite repeating. May I suggest some alternatives?
--------
ame_nebula

ame_nebula.jpg

ame_nebula.7z

--------
ame_starfield

ame_starfield.jpg

ame_starfield.7z

----------
Both are created by 'amethyst7' aka Chris Matz. Details see included file "readme".

[TexasGtar]

The skybox texture looks quite repeating. May I suggest some alternatives?
--------
ame_nebula
ame_nebula.jpg

ame_nebula.7z
--------
ame_starfield
ame_starfield.jpg
ame_starfield.7z
----------
Both are created by 'amethyst7' aka Chris Matz. Details see included file "readme".

Thanks, The skybox was a quick throw together, Nothing fancy. I'll definitely check these out tonight. They are looking pretty cool!

[TexasGtar]

Sorry for the double post admin's.

=================================================================
Here are some comments of things I haven't fixed yet.

Biggie

Buttons messages and all Mission Recap must be embed in map as CriticalEvent messages.

I need a how to make this happen tutorial. How do i embed in map Critical Event Messages? I found them in Info but not sure how they work.

==============================================================
Evil grins
use a Mercenary to guide players along

Have not looked at this yet.
==============================================================
sector 2111

Have not added jumppads. Not worried about bot jumping in this version.
Removed ALL monster waypoints. I still don't get the position 1-100 idea.
Different monsters start in different areas. Do I need a series of 1-whatever in each area? If I have 1-10 in cell block area, do I start a new 1-10 in hallways?
If not are hallway monsters going to try to find position 1 in cell block? I
need to ask Shrimp how these work exactly before I plop some down.
================================================================
OjitroC
For the multi-player MH version you'll need more onscreen messages indicating what people should do/where they should go.

Is this like the critical messages?

==============================================
Biggie
Still working on the boat traveling through closed opening.

==============================================
sector
Yes flag and upside down candle stick are attached to the boat.
Try a simple LAN server and see what you get there... Nothing, trust me, client won't see any candle... Those are net borks that can be avoided by using other non-static actors with a mesh changed and not running animations, simple as that.

Can you explain what I need to do to fix this again? What non static actor? The knife work?

and:
And I REPEAT, All Ammo paths generators can be added later. You can save them elsewhere in a TXT file, build paths in map and PASTE AMMO back, AFTER pathing. It's a simple operating task, nothing complicated preventing a high paths load which have no purpose and no use.

Not sure how to do this.
================================================

Buggie

Priest timer id ridiculous thing. People is very different. Which for someone is fast, for another person is slow. So "perfect timing" simply does not exist.

I agree. Just not sure how to rework it. Maybe I can have the priest teleport away after opening a door....and then spawn a new one once next door is ready to open, or something like that. I can't really think of another way to get around it.

=========================================================

I still have some things I am working on, but this should be a working map with all files included needed to run map.

http://www.mediafire.com/file/vm7presud ... 3.zip/file

===============================================================================
Ps. I forgot to change the nali dead message. Next beta. sorry.

[Buggie]

Read this:
https://utfiles.lagout.org/GameTypes/Mo ... update.pdf

MonsterEvent-A screen displaying message that last around 5 seconds. This is your main instruction actor when creating intros, progressing and outtro's. All players will see this on their screens. Very important actor in telling the ' story ' or just as a ' thank you for playing' message.

About Priest Timer:
Maybe possible toggle Priest when all killed in zone or near to it.

For example if only one monster left activate Priest with delay in 15 seconds with appropriate message about that.
If you want make challenge.

Or simple activate it when all monsters dead.

Or activate by player touch, if you want all left to player.
-------
Empty maze at one end of start zone. Look like unfinished part of map.

Flies can block doors. Better make it slide doors.
Also for player hard open such door from back side.

On start zone fps drop to 15. Not good.

Need message when touch sphere. Something like "Hmm. I think Nali Priest help me with these strange things..."

2 Manta at hole in ceiling before third door always missed. Better move it close to hole.
------
Nali patch to 3 door very strange in some places. Try watch on it.

Laser grid under after first door. What is that? It id deadly or not? Players must know before they touch it and die (or not die).
------
Boats can be triggered from water if you swim near. So you try swim near for get to boat and boat started and go away. Nice.
-----
Nali scared by water monsters and return back. Boats started swim without him. it is not good. Nali should able travel on his boat even if player not clear way.
-------
I delete all TorchFlame and fps stop drop to 15 at start area.

NextAttempt: I set LightType to LT_None for all TorchFlame and FPS stop drop.

So you need adjust LightType for all TorchFlames. Only few must use not LT_None.
This allow you save beautiful look and high FPS.
------
Tested with 10 TorchFlames with LT_Steady. FPS drop to 25, not 16 but too not comfortable.
So better avoid light effects at all for great performance.

Or make 1-2 light effect per visible zone.
------
Skybox still look bad.
I think need bigger sphere for skybox area.
Or make texture smaller. Currently stars too big.

[Barbie]

Buttons messages and all Mission Recap must be embed in map as CriticalEvent messages.

How do i embed in map Critical Event Messages?

I guess the author meant that the game relevant messages should be noticeable by all players. "MonsterHunt.MonsterEvent" is not suitable; I recommend a SpecialEvent with property bBroadcast=True.

need to ask Shrimp how these [MonsterWaypoints] work exactly before I plop some down.

As the code tells, MonsterWaypoints build a chain of locations that have to be visited. Therefore they have a property "Position" which value has to be unique usually, otherwise the MonsterWaypoints with the same value later in the Actor chain are ignored. The first location that has to be reached must have a MonsterWaypoint with Position=1, the next with Position=2 and so on. Gaps in that serial will break the chain.
Every time the according MonsterWaypoint is touched, that MonsterHunt's Go-To-Next-Position is increased by one.


Concerning the Priest: What about an unkillable one?

[Buggie]

Light50 is only one light in cell. So this cell very bright relatively to others. I suggest remove it.

Lantern7 not centered in a cell.
------
Here Modified Skybox from CTF Face, No light from Flames, Removed Light50 and centered Lantern7.

MH-EscapeFromNaZaliBeta3_220200719180134.rar

------
Priest must be brave also. What a point of scared unkillable Priest?
------
Nebula skybox (cube):

MH-EscapeFromNaZaliBeta3_320200719184039.rar

-----
But if you want beautiful skybox - need use sphere with extrapolation 2, filled with stars.
As background. On foreground sheet brashes with stars and others. As masked or translucent 2-sides textures.
Maybe one galaxy consist from few textures.
------
Also box before door 3 not hidden.

[TexasGtar]

More great feedback.

Thank you all so much. You all have been so very helpful. I have to fix a car today, but I will get to addressing all these comments. I think i understand a lot of it.

All of the comments are excellent, some I knew about some are great new ideas that are perfectly inline with map.

I think I finally understand the monster waypoints. They are not to create a path for monsters, they are to create a path for ai bots to get to end. Is that right? Now it makes sense.

I'll get the new skybox map and start fixing these new and older comments as soon as I can.