Is UT just a publicity stunt?

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PrinceOfFunky
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Is UT just a publicity stunt?

Post by PrinceOfFunky »

Think about this, you're a guy who make games, they become famous and you get to understand advertising is good for your games, then you find out you can make people use your work by paying yearly and boom you decide to create a game engine, but hey you didn't advertise it, no one is gonna use it, boom again, you create a game which uses some of the coolest potentials of your engine and you sell that game, everyone likes games, especially if their engine is "cool", and that's it, the game is just a publicity stunt to advertise your engine so that people will create games with it and will make you earn money.
Now, think about Tim Sweeny, he's still working on Unreal Engine (currently UE4), the engine wasn't free initially, but then he set it free with the slogan "If You Love Something, Set It Free", and that's what the page says:
"When you ship a game or application, you pay a 5% royalty on gross revenue after the first $3,000 per product, per quarter. It’s a simple arrangement in which we succeed only when you succeed. "
Setting it free is probably a way to make media talk about the engine and to prompt people to download it in the hope they'll learn how to use it, making then games with it, which will work as publicity stunts themselves.
Plus he started the new UT and coincidentally it is called "Unreal Tournament", just like the one made in 1999? That's probably cause he doesn't want people to be interested ino Unreal Engine 1, since what he rly wants is to make people make games with his new engine.

Do you agree with the above? If so, does it mean this community stands up on a publicity stunt?
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Re: Is UT just a publicity stunt?

Post by Hellkeeper »

U/UT has always been a way to show off the engine's power. I hope you're not discovering it right now.
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PrinceOfFunky
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Re: Is UT just a publicity stunt?

Post by PrinceOfFunky »

Hellkeeper wrote:U/UT has always been a way to show off the engine's power. I hope you're not discovering it right now.
Well I was discovering it step by step, better late than never.
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Re: Is UT just a publicity stunt?

Post by Carbon »

No, I don't agree for too many reasons than I can begin to explain. Primarily:

If the new UT is a publicity stunt, then why wouldn't they put more resources into it and get it done? As it stands, it is nothing, a half-baked game trapped in an endless development loop with only a handful of people working on it internally and besides, there are already a number of games shipping with UE4. Paragon and Fortnite ring any bells? If they are or are not successful is beside the point and those are just the Epic games; there are many non-Epic games shipping and UE4 has already established itself as one of the top go-to engines out there, continuing the long legacy.

UE4 is a very powerful and versatile engine, as Unreal Engines always have been. They don't need to bother with self-promotion as they have a product that will easily sell itself. Epic has always made more money from licensing than actual games, so there is no news there.
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PrinceOfFunky
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Re: Is UT just a publicity stunt?

Post by PrinceOfFunky »

Carbon wrote:No, I don't agree for too many reasons than I can begin to explain. Primarily:

If the new UT is a publicity stunt, then why wouldn't they put more resources into it and get it done? As it stands, it is nothing, a half-baked game trapped in an endless development loop with only a handful of people working on it internally and besides, there are already a number of games shipping with UE4. Paragon and Fortnite ring any bells? If they are or are not successful is beside the point and those are just the Epic games; there are many non-Epic games shipping and UE4 has already established itself as one of the top go-to engines out there, continuing the long legacy.

UE4 is a very powerful and versatile engine, as Unreal Engines always have been. They don't need to bother with self-promotion as they have a product that will easily sell itself. Epic has always made more money from licensing than actual games, so there is no news there.
Everyone needs to bother with self-promotion, you can make the best and innovative game engine ever but without at least a bit of advertising no one will know of its existance.
Maybe they don't put more resources on the new UT so that is never completed, so that people will talk about it forever but not anyone will play it without playing other UE games. Look at the mutators, lifespan of the first UT has been expanded till now, that's all thanks to mutators, people still talk about Unreal Engine 1.
If Epic wanted UT99 to be played for a very long time, why calling the new UT, just Unreal Tournament? (I guess the fact they closed their gamespy UT99 master server list was cause the amount of players was decreasing).
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Re: Is UT just a publicity stunt?

Post by sektor2111 »

I do not get the point... and neither any publicity stunt.
Just two cents down there:
The most of old grognards have a default habit to play UT99. Else they cold see that Post UT99 versions aren't like UT99 which they love - trust me, BillyBill is one of those who still play UT I can feel that, and others too, even if some people think he is gone, I cannot be sure about that.
And now, if EPIC would start an aggressive advertising, perhaps no only me but others as well will put hands in ears because they do not care about forced Advertising - a good product is selling itself not by using stupid NOISE - yeah, that's advertising from me. And yes, human beings at an age wants to fell relaxed and staying away from useless noise. I don't give a damn on advertising and I don't care about OTHER collection of bugs and dumb ideas and other deceptions - I'm one of those deleting even spam e-mails without to even look at them. If you think you'll live 200 years to have patience with all messed up stuff I have doubts... Wait a while, suddenly you'll have 60 Years old I will wanna see your energy in that time... and addiction for working at 200 things and finishing almost nothing...
So to summarize I'm playing UT for its concept which I like, because I can modify things, not because of advertising - the most of advertising locations are blocked by myself because are f'k'n' boring as sh!t... at UT-files there is a RSS feed from some UT4 bot - to be honest I'm not even bother to read anything from there - for me that's SPAM not advertising.
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Re: Is UT just a publicity stunt?

Post by papercoffee »

PrinceOfFunky wrote: If so, does it mean this community stands up on a publicity stunt?
Quake Engine or the new Id Tech 5, CryEngine, Unreal Engine, Source Engine...
All those Engines got sold with a game as a crowd puller. There is nothing new to it... only exception till now is UT4 as Carbon already wrote. Paragon has now the position of former UT versions. To show off what the Engine is capable.

The Epic higher-ups don't belief in the new UT4 and therefore they doesn't want to spend too much money and manpower into this project. It's a vicious circle.
Last edited by papercoffee on Mon Jun 05, 2017 3:55 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Is UT just a publicity stunt?

Post by Carbon »

PrinceOfFunky wrote: Everyone needs to bother with self-promotion, you can make the best and innovative game engine ever but without at least a bit of advertising no one will know of its existance.
Maybe they don't put more resources on the new UT so that is never completed, so that people will talk about it forever but not anyone will play it without playing other UE games. Look at the mutators, lifespan of the first UT has been expanded till now, that's all thanks to mutators, people still talk about Unreal Engine 1.
If Epic wanted UT99 to be played for a very long time, why calling the new UT, just Unreal Tournament? (I guess the fact they closed their gamespy UT99 master server list was cause the amount of players was decreasing).
I'm not sure if you know what you're talking about.

"...so that people will talk about it forever but not anyone will play it without playing other UE games". :noidea

UE1 is dead in terms of development and UE4 need very little formal advertising because of its legacy and again, current games using it. UT is an exceptionally slow development, but it is being worked on with regular updates and builds coming out all the time.

It's fine to love UT99 but that doesn't mean you have to hate or disparage everything else. Too many folks living in the past and denying the present on very suspect convictions. :confused2:
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Re: Is UT just a publicity stunt?

Post by JackGriffin »

Go back and watch the video where everyone gets together and announces the new UT. Those are people who have been working in and around UT as long or longer than anyone else here. Fucking rock stars like Stacey Conley (Flak) have spent years keeping the master server running long past when every other support withered away. Polge and Sweeney have given and given. You think those people don't *LOVE* Unreal Tournament as much as you and I and the rest of the forum? These people recommitted to a dead game because they feel the way they do. Don't shit on that without really considering your position.

I know for a fact that some of them do read this board. You are certainly entitled to your opinion but I could not disagree more with it. It's a slap in the face to infer they aren't working still on this because it's a passion project and denigrate it by calling it a publicity stunt. *Of course* they want to make money on the engine, it's their business model but that's a very long walk from where you are standing.

Getting a triple A or better game done is a massive project. It takes a long time and requires a ton of effort. They've just chosen to pull back the curtain and let you see how the sausage is made. Don't confuse that with thinking they aren't totally in love with this franchise in the same way we are.

Edit: Hi Carbon! :waves:
So long, and thanks for all the fish
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Re: Is UT just a publicity stunt?

Post by PrinceOfFunky »

I think I found out the biggest proof of my mistake, english Wikipedia page about "Epic Games" says:
"In 1998, Epic MegaGames released Unreal, a 3D first-person shooter co-developed with Digital Extremes, which expanded into a series of Unreal games. The company also began to license the core technology, the Unreal Engine, to other game developers."
In the italian version (which sometimes it's not that reliable) says:
"La tecnologia e il motore grafico usati per costruire Unreal (e i successivi capitoli), chiamato Unreal engine, è stato in seguito dato in licenza ad altri sviluppatori, facendo nascere svariati giochi."
Which basically says the same but adding "in seguito" which means "later", so it says Unreal Engine began to license after Unreal was published.
If it is like that, what I said before must loose points lol.
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Re: Is UT just a publicity stunt?

Post by Carbon »

Well, that;s what you get for reading Wikipedia. A little knowledge is a dangerous thing. :)

Hiya Jack! Good to hear you have some vacation time! Enjoy mate! Mine is in a couple of weeks. *whew*
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