A whip?

Discussions about UT99
JackGriffin
Godlike
Posts: 3774
Joined: Fri Jan 14, 2011 1:53 pm
Personal rank: -Retired-

Re: A whip?

Post by JackGriffin »

The first person view you could make very convincing since it's 2D. The problem is creating something in 3D third person that has any sort of applied physics that react to environment. You could do a chained segment of three or four chunks but having actual links that respond to hitting things would be quite tough.
So long, and thanks for all the fish
User avatar
Leo(T.C.K.)
Inhuman
Posts: 868
Joined: Sat Aug 13, 2011 10:26 pm

Re: A whip?

Post by Leo(T.C.K.) »

I really don't understand why would there be need of individual pieces reacting etc.

Did Unreal or UT have a hyper realistic weapon like that? If mesh is concerned that's made of a single mesh, then it's easy. The "multiple parts" mesh was suggested as a way of simulating a whip where a real mesh is lacking.

I don't create stuff that's modern and hyper realistic, I never did nor is that my plan. I like/engage in stuff that's more or less within the range of the original game content.

Basically, it's not problem for me to say modify existing mesh not necessarily a whip, by deleting some polygons away from it and make it a whip mesh. In theory, if thieveryut has some whip/chain like weapon (mace on chain perhaps?) then it will be actually possible for me to modify this mesh to resemble something else.

The whole purpose of this thread was more like "What are your suggestions that could be used?" when a real whip is lacking.

I never played Thievery btw.
JackGriffin
Godlike
Posts: 3774
Joined: Fri Jan 14, 2011 1:53 pm
Personal rank: -Retired-

Re: A whip?

Post by JackGriffin »

If you don't use some sort of chained segments then it will be visually lacking in all but perfect scenarios. You'll see the whip pass through players when they get hit, it won't react to walls, etc when it hits them. Really the beauty of a chained segment is it's behavior when physics are applied to it, otherwise you have a 2D Doom weapon.

I don't think this is so much about modern hyper-realism as it is about adequate. You'd think something like this wouldn't be out of the realm but much for the same reasons there aren't decent vehicles in UT this will also be very hard to do in an acceptable way.

That being said have you ever messed with dot's physics stuff and tried to port it into UT?
So long, and thanks for all the fish
User avatar
Leo(T.C.K.)
Inhuman
Posts: 868
Joined: Sat Aug 13, 2011 10:26 pm

Re: A whip?

Post by Leo(T.C.K.) »

It's still possible to script it in a way that will adjust the offset if it hits an actor/wall earlier. Therefore it will not actually pass the wall/player.

Me and codex came up with a way to even do melee attacks without using actual animations, by having a hack script that adjust the offset realtime to simulate animation. With tricks like these it will be possible to still make a whip like that using just a single mesh.
JackGriffin
Godlike
Posts: 3774
Joined: Fri Jan 14, 2011 1:53 pm
Personal rank: -Retired-

Re: A whip?

Post by JackGriffin »

There's a difference between possible and pretty. You can register the hit but what do you do with the "S" whip shape? Without a joint what happens?
So long, and thanks for all the fish
User avatar
Leo(T.C.K.)
Inhuman
Posts: 868
Joined: Sat Aug 13, 2011 10:26 pm

Re: A whip?

Post by Leo(T.C.K.) »

It will just play standard animation, but you can randomize it too.
As in have it play different animations each time. Works for me.

It's still a game. I don't need it to realistically bounce/bent off the ground in "over 9000" ways.

And you know that good basic animation can do a lot. Look at Unreal models how well they were animated. Alcapowned often captured this quality of animation in his work too. It does make an impact on the overall feeling how well it animates.
JackGriffin
Godlike
Posts: 3774
Joined: Fri Jan 14, 2011 1:53 pm
Personal rank: -Retired-

Re: A whip?

Post by JackGriffin »

I spent quite a while today going over dot's Phys mod and seeing if there was a way to implement it that I'm capable of doing. It's just way over my head. I still think that you could get really close to visually right by using something with three segments. Do a quick trace from the hand to the end of the whip and cause it to render a bent animation at the closest "joint". It's all smoke and mirrors to an extent but it would work and you'd get feedback that you hit something.
So long, and thanks for all the fish
User avatar
Leo(T.C.K.)
Inhuman
Posts: 868
Joined: Sat Aug 13, 2011 10:26 pm

Re: A whip?

Post by Leo(T.C.K.) »

Either way I don't think I've found the "right" mesh yet for anything.

That time might still come. I have a lot of other things to tack on still.
JackGriffin
Godlike
Posts: 3774
Joined: Fri Jan 14, 2011 1:53 pm
Personal rank: -Retired-

Re: A whip?

Post by JackGriffin »

If you ever do I'm willing to take a shot at it. I figured out quite a lot on close range impact stuff while working on the frying pan. It wouldn't be overly tough to convert that into a melee weapon with a larger range.
So long, and thanks for all the fish
User avatar
Leo(T.C.K.)
Inhuman
Posts: 868
Joined: Sat Aug 13, 2011 10:26 pm

Re: A whip?

Post by Leo(T.C.K.) »

hmm. I wonder if the frying pan model could be used..nah that would be like a baton if I "shaved" it off the actual pan polygons, LOL.

That reminds me, I was gonna work on a small baton mod but I had to put it aside for the time being. I do have the mesh etc though.

It was going to be a port of the unreal 2 alpha baton basically. It didn't truly work there because vertmesh animations made the game stuck.

But it was working otherwise. If in u2 alpha you selected a different mesh for it.

Also I do have the mesh/resources out too.
JackGriffin
Godlike
Posts: 3774
Joined: Fri Jan 14, 2011 1:53 pm
Personal rank: -Retired-

Re: A whip?

Post by JackGriffin »

That could almost be done just with a mesh replacement. Range would be very similar to the pan. How do the hands look in first person?
So long, and thanks for all the fish
User avatar
Leo(T.C.K.)
Inhuman
Posts: 868
Joined: Sat Aug 13, 2011 10:26 pm

Re: A whip?

Post by Leo(T.C.K.) »

Not sure if they are UV mapped, but I believe they have some uv mappin that was lacking from the version since technically stunbaton skaarjglove etc were created for an earlier version.
However I can create some mapping for it so they have skin. If they have the skin same like the saarjglove, i al;ready created a stand in skin for that that makes it look like the player is using hands from automag. I made an unfinished version of the skaarjglove mod, do you want it? It was uploaded but noted it was wip.

--------- Merged posts ------------

The Hand of the stunbaton and skaarjglove is exactly same so that repurposed skin will fit.

The thing is I can't find the modified stunbaton mesh I was working on but its not a big deal, I can do something about it still. I will also modify the skaarjglove mesh for better skin.

Nevermind that, it doesn't work as expected, I'll just do the baton itself with some slot reassigning.
Last edited by Dr.Flay on Sat Dec 09, 2017 3:30 am, edited 1 time in total.
Reason: merged double post
User avatar
Leo(T.C.K.)
Inhuman
Posts: 868
Joined: Sat Aug 13, 2011 10:26 pm

Re: A whip?

Post by Leo(T.C.K.) »

skaarjglovetest
stunbaton - this is just the plain mesh/stuff, however I did write a description there. Original mesh is also included. I did include the uv maps too so a skin can be basically made. The baton itself wasn't uv mapped before (it was more like explosion of pixels), now part of it has been set to meshenviromap for use with firetextures etc while the rest should have the mapping and real texture applied to it.

I suppose technically this is a double post but how else would be someone alterted that I posted these links now?

EDIT: Think about electiricity firetexture applied at the meshenviroslot (3)

EDIT2: skaarjgloveuv
Here's a basic skaarj glove uv mapped with a temp skin, though those actual blade polys could be set back to meshenviro but just that...though that's easily done with unrealfx and similar.
But at least you get a mesh that doesn't have that entire part set or almost entire....I originally did it in the skaarjglovetest by selecting each individual polygon..until I found out I didn't have to do that at all but whatever. I might have missed a couple in that one anyway but yea that was a ton of wasted time.
Post Reply