An attempt to improve UT99.forum's atmosphere.

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OjitroC
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Re: An attempt to improve UT99.forum's atmosphere.

Post by OjitroC »

Feralidragon wrote: So, as far as my own opinion goes, the only things that can actually be improved in this forum are of a technical nature ...
Totallly agree with everything you say. Would suggest, though, that the previously floated idea of a 'Discussion' in which inexperienced people could post their work (maps, code, etc) be taken up - this would help to separate possibily flawed content from the more polished content and allow people to give constructive and polite feedback on submitted work in the knowledge that that work has been done by someone with lower skill levels. This might help to avoid or reduce the overly harsh and demoralising comments that some newcomers have received.
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Gadavre
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Re: An attempt to improve UT99.forum's atmosphere.

Post by Gadavre »

I know a little about the coders of this site, and if I know. that person is well versed in that, how to create a new weapon I'll write him a personal message. If the coder understands the intelligence of bots, I will write to him. This tactic gives faster results. No one wants to create the mod or mutator for several years.

I believe that a beginner should choose as a mentor of some coder or mapper. In such case, he will develop quickly. If a newbie listens to a coder, and tomorrow he will listen to the other, it can confuse even more. Each coder has its own way of solving a particular task and these ways can contradict each other.
Terraniux
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Re: An attempt to improve UT99.forum's atmosphere.

Post by Terraniux »

Nice reactions so far. Good thinking.
Oh and btw, I have written points, you should not consider them as BIG changes, just some 'it could be improvements' .
Nice to see that people are coming up with ideas as wel.

About the mirror thing FeraliDragon, here:
My experiences share me, that when people see a mirror, they "KNOW". When they close their eyes, they KNOW. When another person tells them, they don't know.
YOU fill in the gaps..
.
I know this is offtopic but this pretty much shows what I mean, yet a maybe helpful addtion to the top.c:
They use fruit and stuff here, but it is about the science here / phycology here. The fruit and stuff should be seen as 'posting' .
You will get the idea. A person is ignorant when told, but a mirror tells them all, so they know it already....

It takes approx 8 mins, nice to see with coffee or tea or something! :agree1:
5GCzYhvfr3I
another article :
http://www.thoughtfulparent.com/2009/10 ... -test.html

.... / end off topci

ok, keep on talking. We are on the right track!
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fudgonaut
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Re: An attempt to improve UT99.forum's atmosphere.

Post by fudgonaut »

I don’t know if the atmosphere is really all that bad. There has been hostility, but with certain personalities electing to depart on their own, it feels like a good time to abandon old aggravations and embrace the new year with some positive UT-ing.
OjitroC wrote:Would suggest, though, that the previously floated idea of a 'Discussion' in which inexperienced people could post their work (maps, code, etc) be taken up
This following may be a little off-topic, but I think it dovetails with part of the discussion here. Bear with me…

Back in the day, I used to be pretty good at UT. My fragging skills are now old, rusty, and a little sad. But I will always love UT and CTF. It’s what first got me into gaming. For no particular reason other than a little extra downtime, I started up UnrealEd and played around with it. I’ve been working on my first map (CTF) for a while now. The map has had many false starts and iterations. I’ve reached a point where think I’m ready to try building (what is hopefully) the final layout.

Part of me has been thinking “I’ll just slave over this project quietly, and hope to make a big splash when I finally release it. And if I don’t finish it, no one will be annoyed because I haven’t promised anything.”

But after reading this thread and similar threads, I’m wondering: would it be worth it to people on the forum if I start a dedicated work-in-progress thread for it? With an open invitation to more experienced mappers to make observations & suggestions.

I can start by
  • Describing the initial idea
  • Digging up a couple sketches & scribbles I’ve made
  • Outlining the methodology / approach I’m using
  • Describing what I’m hoping to achieve (later comparing those expectations to the final product)
  • Updating the thread with screenshots, and updating the map/texture file as I go
  • Inviting people to go into the map (such as it is), wander around, share thoughts, etc.
I would try to document my steps and keep it focused in discreet stages, in what I think would be a logical order:
  • Conceptualization
  • Geometry
  • Movers, special brushes, meshes, etc.
  • Triggers, pickup placement, etc
  • Bot pathing (my greatest concern)
  • Texturing
  • Lighting
  • Audio and music
  • (if this list seems out of order, or if I’m missing any key elements, let me know)
The thread would document the making of a (overly-ambitious) map, from soup to nuts. In a way it would be half WIP, half tutorial, half discussion. Yes, that's three halves.

This is where the community comes in.

If there are some experience folks who are willing to take a little time to check out the progress and respond, the thread would also provide some crowd-sourced pro-tips, dos and donts, etc.. And ideally, the final product would be that much more polished for everyone, and act as a blueprint to encourage other members to start their own project.

I don’t want to commit to maintaining such a thread if:
  • There’s not that much community interest in it
  • The thread will irritate forum members (“oh, it’s fudgonaut with another annoying update”)
  • Folks don’t have enough bandwidth to contribute feedback. This is the big one. If there aren’t enough people to make it more than just me updating a WIP thread, I’d rather just keep applying my meager spare time to working on the map itself.
Would this be worthwhile? Thoughts?
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Cronoloop
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Re: An attempt to improve UT99.forum's atmosphere.

Post by Cronoloop »

this is a post i'd see in a children forum

we're all 30+ here, do you guys really need this?
if someone says something you dislike you get hurt? lol. ignore it maybe? or talk shit in pm?
mods are very active (maybe too much) so it's not a problem

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Re: An attempt to improve UT99.forum's atmosphere.

Post by Terraniux »

But after reading this thread and similar threads, I’m wondering: would it be worth it to people on the forum if I start a dedicated work-in-progress thread for it? With an open invitation to more experienced mappers to make observations & suggestions.
YES! This what I am preaching! Make content and make topics! People see, and people react! Absolutely YES!

Your order doesn't matter, as long you are willing to make and willing to learn! Yet, having a logical order would be nice .... depends on the person.
If it works out for you, ok, please share!

When you opened a topic, you started a certain interest. People with interest, which are a lot, will look and give feedback!
The only holdback of reacting is their own reason. No time, lack of actual interest, or too tired, or willing to give feedback but another time, or something else. This is internet.
The thread will irritate forum members (“oh, it’s fudgonaut with another annoying update”)
Please Ignore that. No better, forget that!

What Ferali said >>
5. Provide more content: While more content helps, it has to come from the heart.
What I mean with this is that content should be made for fun, or with prospects of having fun with it, and it should be willing from the person, and not a chore.
^^ this.
Intention is ALL.
If there are some experience folks who are willing to take a little time to check out the progress and respond, the thread would also provide some crowd-sourced pro-tips, dos and donts, etc.. And ideally, the final product would be that much more polished for everyone, and act as a blueprint to encourage other members to start their own project.

Another intention of me, by this topic. More content, more happy people, more laughing. More content!!! :thuup: :thuup: :thuup: :thuup:

When a circle rotates, you can see it with your eyes closed. With your eyes opened people fail to see. Human behaviour.


I thank you for your post fudgonaut.
:gj:
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OjitroC
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Re: An attempt to improve UT99.forum's atmosphere.

Post by OjitroC »

fudgonaut wrote: Would this be worthwhile? Thoughts?
The answer to that is yes it would be worthwhile.
Cronoloop wrote: do you guys really need this?
The answer to this is also yes.
Cronoloop wrote: mods are very active (maybe too much) so it's not a problem
If you've read all the relevant threads (not just this one), then you'll see that most posters agree that there has been a problem ('drama') with overly aggressive posts creating, in part anyway, what another poster here rightly describes as a "hostile environment". The main thrust here is to ensure that this fourm remains a pleasant place to visit with discussions conducted in a civil and helpful manner; that, surely, is worthwhile but it does require mods to be active and enforce the site's rules. So again, I wouldn't agree that mods are or have been too active but, rather, possibly not active enough at the right times (hitherto anyway).
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Re: An attempt to improve UT99.forum's atmosphere.

Post by papercoffee »

OjitroC wrote:
fudgonaut wrote: Would this be worthwhile? Thoughts?
The answer to that is yes it would be worthwhile.
I subscribe this...
OjitroC wrote:
Cronoloop wrote: do you guys really need this?
The answer to this is also yes.
...This I don't. We have our House Rules.
We don't need a CoC.
OjitroC wrote:
Cronoloop wrote: mods are very active (maybe too much) so it's not a problem
If you've read all the relevant threads (not just this one), then you'll see that most posters agree that there has been a problem ('drama') with overly aggressive posts creating, in part anyway, what another poster here rightly describes as a "hostile environment". The main thrust here is to ensure that this fourm remains a pleasant place to visit with discussions conducted in a civil and helpful manner; that, surely, is worthwhile but it does require mods to be active and enforce the site's rules. So again, I wouldn't agree that mods are or have been too active but, rather, possibly not active enough at the right times (hitherto anyway).
Well, the moderators are now more active. Especially me.
If something is happening which goes against the House Rules PM the staff or mark the post with the little exclamation mark in that triangle in the right corner of the offending post.

:wink:
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OjitroC
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Re: An attempt to improve UT99.forum's atmosphere.

Post by OjitroC »

papercoffee wrote:...This I don't. We have our House Rules. We don't need a CoC..
No, agreed - I just meant it's useful to have this discussion (but not to overdo it, of course).
papercoffee wrote: Well, the moderators are now more active. Especially me.
Indeed and that's good to see. :D
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Re: An attempt to improve UT99.forum's atmosphere.

Post by Feralidragon »

@fudgonaut: I think you should really do it.
I am in a similar situation as you with something else, and for a long time I was on the fence the same way you are right now.

However, I made a decision recently that I will show what I am up to as well. While at this point in time there isn't a finish line in direct sight, at least it shows the community that there's something going on, which may as well be the difference between some people to completely leave the place over stagnation, or to at least keep an eye on things to come.
Even if you don't manage to finish it for any reason (and the community is full of unfinished stuff), if the overall mentality becomes to actually show progress, and as long as at least some of that progress translates into things like actual releases, people may stick around and give you the feedback that you need to improve what you're doing.

Having that said however, it shouldn't take much of your time to show your progress, relative the actual time you allocate to make progress.
A couple of screenshots, and maybe 1 or 2 lines of text describing things up is enough. Of course, perhaps in your case you need more, and you can either start with a big post first, or split it across posts over time.

Either way, I think you should go ahead and do it, and not to worry if you're actually going to finish it. Although I understand VERY well the kind of pressure that can be put onto your shoulders to finish it, but then in that case remember that any "pressure" put here for a release is actually meaningless in the end since it's your own work, your time and your terms, you don't owe anyone anything, and this includes even releasing it at all.
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Re: An attempt to improve UT99.forum's atmosphere.

Post by SilverSound »

I think it's good you guys want to talk about it. But I'm not sure it's a great idea to bring that much attention to it. You make it out like it's the end of the world or something.


I've seen some toxic forums and this? This is nothing at all.....I can link to a halo 1 PC forum site that is overrun with toxicity and non active/toxic admins. THAT marks the end of new comers.

Also 30+?? I'm 21...
"Woah what?! I wish I was recording that...."
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Re: An attempt to improve UT99.forum's atmosphere.

Post by Terraniux »

SilverSound wrote:I think it's good you guys want to talk about it. But I'm not sure it's a great idea to bring that much attention to it. You make it out like it's the end of the world or something.


I've seen some toxic forums and this? This is nothing at all.....I can link to a halo 1 PC forum site that is overrun with toxicity and non active/toxic admins. THAT marks the end of new comers.

Also 30+?? I'm 21...
This is also in reply to Chronoloop.


Like the topic says..... It's an attempt! To hopefully minimize , eventually stop arguing, fights and useless debates over nothing. Regardless of age and mentality.
To help newcomers, to produce more content and bring solutions to the matter.

Everyone should reply, if they have a opinion. If my points aren't improvements, I'm more than happy to hear everyone voice here. :highfive:
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