Re-release for all UT S3TC textures

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Diehard
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Re: Re-release for all UT S3TC textures

Post by Diehard »

As i already said, i dont play the game myself, and that has a downside, i rely heavelly on bugreports from people that actually play the game. if i release new S3TC packages, i always listen carefully to UTers to see if bugs apear. In most cases i myself cause the bugs mostly due to enormous amount work that needs to be done, and (stupid) mistakes are easelly made.

Where possible, i try to have the problems fixed within 24 hours, so players that use my texture do not need to endure my error for longer than 24 hours. My health often gets in the way of that, but still i do my best to fix it within that period.

What is left are problems that simply happen due to Epic choices in the past, or renderers that fail to render the textures properly, or the tools i use are inadequate to process the packages correctly. For all goes, that i contact people that can solve certain issues, for renderers this is Chris Dohnel and Smirftsch, for the mergertool this was Kerilk and latelly Casey. Epic issues(read skating player glitch) i couldnt turn to anyone, because it was unknow what causes the error, except that people like Protos and Lee_Stricklin did setup test servers to test if there was a serverside fix for this.

Those tests had as result that it was clear that most errors were gone if the textures from the 1st CD were used instead of the reduced netextures and the 2nd CD textures. Well most errors were gone, i never got any bugreports anymore where the bug was mentioned. The occasions that the bug was reported, always were solved by installing the 1CD texture downloads i offer.

And to make sure everybody could use the 1st CD downloads, i made sure the were available for any platform as zip, rar, 7z, tar, sitx. All this is simply an attempt to help out the UT community and nothing more. And for the record, i never heard of the problem anymore, so i simply asumed it was fixed.

In the meantime, we still tried to find a clientside fix, that works independ from the server setups around. And very recently we found out what caused the error to begin with(thanks to Paperk and Usaar33) and it indeed pointed to what already was expected. Its the reduced net textures and the 2nd CD textures that simply are not conform to eachother.

Because of my illness i could not release the fixed packages when the cause was known. Than about a week ago, Protos reported that he did get the skating player glitch while the server was loaded with the proper 1st CD textures. So effectivelly the error should NOT occur, but it did :( . Within 24 hours i was able to find which S3TC package in this case was causing the problems(XpbFX) and i decided to test it on Protos server with a package that was made conform. And it worked, the glitch was gone.

Because i was feeling relative ok at that time, i decided to reprocess all packages and and re-release them to try fix the problem forgood. On release i told everybody to replace all textures and that i sincerelly hope the problem is fixed now. And the only other thing i did was to try keep admins telling to switch out their textures, just to keep on the safe side. And that never was ment to force admins YOU HAVE TO SWITCH ! No, it was simply an attempt to have players pointing admins to switch because they simply might not know the nettextures can cause errors on clientsided end. Nothing more, its just a serious request because not every admin reads the Beyond Unreal forums, the Unreal Admins forums or these forums.


And since i heavelly rely on bugreports, i can only wait till people tell me, if they still encounter the problem or not. And i really hope that the problem is solved, and that S3TC players simply can go to any server, regardless if the server is running the 1st CD texture, the reduced net textures or any mix of them. I really hope the problem is solved forgood independ what the server runs. But it still means, that i try to convince server admins to switch to the 1st CD textures, as said, just be on the safe side, nothing more............

See above, and stop this silly game. If you don't want to address my question, quit wasting my time dancing around it. You know good and well how it affects players on my server. You've spent the last bit "fixing" it (yet again).
As i said before, i dont play UT, and i know Unreal pretty well. But you might think i know, but i really, really, really dont know :???: I rely on people like you, and you simply refuse to tell what can happen if the textures are switched. I REALLY DONT KNOW, so for peats sake tell what effects it has. If you keep being like that, it simply doesnt help me to do the correct thing. I NEED that info! So stop telling me i know, because its what i said from start, i DONT KNOW! damnit........

And if you refuse to tell, me, than please, someone else tell me on his behalf, because this is going nowhere, i dont know....

The only thing i know is, and this applies to the stock sounds, maps, music files, textures, .u files etc. The client and the server both need to have the packages installed and they need to be netcompatible. The server runs the map, but effectivelly the client only plays with the files that are sitting in his own UT installation, and does not get anything from the server. So the map is loaded locally, the textures are loaded locally, the soundfiles are loaded locally, etc. etc.

And regardless what textures the server uses, the client loads the textures that are sitting in his own local texture folder. And that aplies to all files. And i simply dont understand how the serverfiles can affect the client, as he plays only with his local files. And as i said before, if i miss something than for peats sake fill me in! Teach me! Because i dont know...... And stop telling me i do, because i simply dont.


So the question remains for me, what difference is there if the server uses the 1st CD textures, or if it uses the reduced net textures? There, i bluntly ask it, and please give a bluntly reply that tells me the difference, or things that happen?
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gopostal

Re: Re-release for all UT S3TC textures

Post by gopostal »

Diehard wrote:As i already said, i dont play the game myself...

As i said before, i dont play UT, and i know Unreal pretty well. But you might think i know, but i really, really, really dont know :???: I rely on people like you, and you simply refuse to tell what can happen if the textures are switched. I REALLY DONT KNOW, so for peats sake tell what effects it has. If you keep being like that, it simply doesnt help me to do the correct thing. I NEED that info! So stop telling me i know, because its what i said from start, i DONT KNOW! damnit........

And if you refuse to tell, me, than please, someone else tell me on his behalf, because this is going nowhere, i dont know....
OMG, you mean to tell me you are messing around with all these servers and you have this level of knowledge? Dude it is INCUMBENT on you to be fully versed in this stuff if you are going to ram these changes down every admins throat. One of the cardinal rules developers have is to make every attempt to not affect other people's work. Just because your textures are pretty, you think you are immune to that. You have changed the landscape of UT, and you don't have a clue.
Diehard wrote: And regardless what textures the server uses, the client loads the textures that are sitting in his own local texture folder. And that aplies to all files. And i simply dont understand how the serverfiles can affect the client, as he plays only with his local files. And as i said before, if i miss something than for peats sake fill me in! Teach me! Because i dont know...... And stop telling me i do, because i simply dont.
The fact you cannot answer this is why I hate it. You are unable to fix this, so you just throw your stuff out there and hope for the best, knowing it affects me and a hundred other server owners. Until you can COMPLETELY make this client side you should have the good grace to stop. Petition Epic to help, sacrifice a goat, pray, whatever but MAKE IT WORK without forcing me to do your beta testing. Did I ask you to beta test any of my stuff? Oh I forgot, you DON'T PLAY.
Diehard wrote: So the question remains for me, what difference is there if the server uses the 1st CD textures, or if it uses the reduced net textures? There, i bluntly ask it, and please give a bluntly reply that tells me the difference, or things that happen?
Because that is not how I want MY server to be. Epic didn't give it to me that way, Gameservers didn't set it up that way, and dammit I don't think I should have to alter my stuff to fix your shortcomings as a developer.

@Creavion: I'm sorry if you dislike my discussion at this project. Feel free to alter anything I do that exceeds the forum rules.
Diehard
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Re: Re-release for all UT S3TC textures

Post by Diehard »

I guess the discussion ends there.

I do know how this stuff works, and i am certainly not an idiot. As i see it now, you just keep being mysterious about the effect it has if servers use the 1st CD textures. So this leaves 3 options:

- There actually is something i dont know. (and so be it, i am an idiot........)
- You dont understand yourself how it all works, and thats regardless the fact you run servers for years.
- Last option, you lie, and you know damn well nothing happens when the textures are switched.

I stuck out my hand to you by saying, that if there really is something that causes a technical issue if textures are switched, than please tell me. I tried to solve the issue by letting you tell me what can happen and what i am doing wrong, so i can deal with that new (to me unknown) situation. If there really is an issue, than i am the first to see if its something i can solve, which is how i deal with all bugreports.

You just keep refusing to tell me what the bug is, so wtf do you want? I am asking you to tell what bug it causes, and you now are calling me an idiot and a fraud, but you still wont tell me what bug can apear if a server is loaded with the 1st CD textures.

So I reach you a hand to try solve it, and the only thing you do is rip off my arm.


And better understand that everyone else reading the posts here can read i try to solve the case while you persists in NOT telling what the problem is. How the fuck do want to see it solved if i dont know what can happen?
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gopostal

Re: Re-release for all UT S3TC textures

Post by gopostal »

Nvm, bro. It's time for me to leave the island.

Have fun guys. Take care of UT. It was good to me.
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Lee_Stricklin
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Re: Re-release for all UT S3TC textures

Post by Lee_Stricklin »

Feralidragon wrote:Why I don't like? For some reasons that Lee Stricklin was never able to reply to me (and he's one of the biggest fans of this project and tries to promote it a lot, and I guess he's doing the right thing):
- Do you know how many years I see Lee Stricklin saying: "there's no problems anymore..."
I'm gonna have to call you out on this one. I've always talked about how improved the textures looked, but I also earned a reputation for bugging the hell out of admins for not having the correct textures on their server and I've always stressed that CD1, Chaos, and Bonus Pack 4 textures needed to be on the server and for the longest time I've always had a link on my forum signatures that send you to the site to get the correct packages. I'm also returning after a short break (Xonotic/Nexuiz and Pokemon kinda ate up some of my time) from UT99 and will further test these textures to see if I see skaters.
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Creavion
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Re: Re-release for all UT S3TC textures

Post by Creavion »

gopostal wrote:Nvm, bro. It's time for me to leave the island.

Have fun guys. Take care of UT. It was good to me.
Interesting, after that what happened YOU are pissed of?
About to be non-active
My very last UT map project: CTF-FacePalm (tropical CTF-Face remake)
Why do I leave? click here
What I want to do next: Joining an UDK team (uncertain however) and improve 3D modelling and texture editing skills
Thanks to those who visibly supported me until/at the end!
My reactivated account on indiedb.com.
gopostal

Re: Re-release for all UT S3TC textures

Post by gopostal »

No Crev, not angry at all. I have nothing but admiration for Die in the work he is doing. I just happen to think it is misguided in it's execution is all.

A while back I listed all the things I wanted to accomplish, and looking at it last week I realized I am done. It's no secret I've been "leaving" for a while, and now just seems like a good time for it. I'm not a DM player at all, MH is really all I do and the servers are increasingly empty. At one time good server knowledge was a useful tool but so few servers remain they are mostly run by admins familiar with the UT engine. My useful time has passed, survival was a bust, the coding school went unused, and I guess I really have little left to offer the community as a whole.

No, there is zero bad feelings here.
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Creavion
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Re: Re-release for all UT S3TC textures

Post by Creavion »

In todays times its nearly useless to come up with new gametypes or similar stuff. The community has shrunken to much that this is worth the effort. There are not even any new Assault maps up. Its just to much work or to difficult. Chronoshift was the very last one I saw. I also dont know how I have to prepare a assault map. And BTW: you are by far not the only one with canceled or "failed" projects.
About to be non-active
My very last UT map project: CTF-FacePalm (tropical CTF-Face remake)
Why do I leave? click here
What I want to do next: Joining an UDK team (uncertain however) and improve 3D modelling and texture editing skills
Thanks to those who visibly supported me until/at the end!
My reactivated account on indiedb.com.
gopostal

Re: Re-release for all UT S3TC textures

Post by gopostal »

Thanks for replying. There are a handful of people that I honestly care about their opinions of me and you happen to be one. I'm glad you see.

I really wanted to accomplish a full server controller for MH, several mods for it, assorted fixes, and an entire MH version upgrade. I did all these and to keep going will only "over develop" them. I released all source and permissions as I went so nothing is lost and anyone can pick up and keep trucking.

My son asked me two days ago why we don't go fishing any more. I didn't have a good answer. I need to fix that now.
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Hook
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Re: Re-release for all UT S3TC textures

Post by Hook »

UT has pretty much ALL it needs now. :wink:

Except one thing...
What is it that Any Possible NEW players look for when they decide to "PLAY" a game? (hint hint)
They do Not look for New mods, New maps, New textures, etc. - nothing like that at all.

The Over Whelming Single Most thing I hear from NEW players is - They Look to see IF, and more importantly, HOW MANY Players are PLAYING the game online! (still)
They LOVE the idea that there are Still Players PLAYING UT online and then wish to get UT and PLAY it!
This is what WE all NEED to do MORE of to keep UT99 alive!
The more people that PLAY it - the more people that WILL PLAY it!
We generally Like the game Because others Play it also! Me too!
I see more and more people creating things for UT but by far, More and More UT people Not PLAYING UT as much or anymore at all!
Again, I am talking about people that ARE Still INTO UT but don't PLAY it!
I am guilty also of not PLAYING UT as much as I want to or Should be playing it!!!
Have we Forgotten WHY we got into UT in the first place? (I think I did) :|
I plan on remedying that as much as possible!
So - PLAY UT online and PLAY it much more often. - I am going to! :wink:
That is the MAIN Key to keeping UT alive! :tu:
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n][c][o
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Re: Re-release for all UT S3TC textures

Post by n][c][o »

Well guys, I'd like to add one small advantage of S3TC textures, you have mostly forgotten to notice ( And thats one of the reasons why I like this project, gopostal ).
Has anyone of you seen the UT movies Incarnation, TNT^ - The Movie, Assault Legendary etc. ?? :)
They wouldn't look so awesome without the S3TC textures. ;)
nicio
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Hook
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Re: Re-release for all UT S3TC textures

Post by Hook »

n][c][o wrote:Well guys, I'd like to add one small advantage of S3TC textures, you have mostly forgotten to notice ( And thats one of the reasons why I like this project, gopostal ).
Has anyone of you seen the UT movies Incarnation, TNT^ - The Movie, Assault Legendary etc. ?? :)
They wouldn't look so awesome without the S3TC textures. ;)
Yep, they "LOOK" good - for movies mainly! :wink:
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UT99 Server -> CROSSBONES Missile Madness {CMM}

* Newest Versions of: PRO-Redeemers | PRO-SNIPER-Redeemers | PRO-SEEKER-Redeemers <-(the Original)
and Now with FOOD FIGHT and Frying Pan arena !!!
IP: 68.232.181.236:7777 <-(NEW IP to come)
UT99 MH Server -> {CMH} CROSSBONES Monster Hunt (MH) by Mars007 (The Original) - IP: 108.61.238.93:7777
Skillz

Re: Re-release for all UT S3TC textures

Post by Skillz »

Good work on the S3TC textures Diehard, are those versions currently on ut-files.com? If not, I think I can transfer them directly from the host you are using at the moment. No point in doing that if they are the same though.


LOL @ some of those comments. :lol:
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Feralidragon
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Re: Re-release for all UT S3TC textures

Post by Feralidragon »

Well, since this thread might rise up another storm around here AGAIN, I will LOCK it now.

DieHard, if you want this thread openned again, just PM me then :wink:

LOCKED
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