"HD" skins and server performance

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neo2k76
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"HD" skins and server performance

Post by neo2k76 » Wed Sep 16, 2020 7:13 pm

Hi there .-)

I'm currently working on a new player skin. Yesterday I installed a directx11 renderer and recognized, that it makes this skin - as well as the preinstalled default epic skins - quite pixelated. So I tried using some bigger graphic dimensions. It worked with 1024x1024 and 2048x2048 pixels, which looks less pixelated.
Blut before reworking all textures, I'd like to know if larger textures have a negative impact on the server performance.
Does anybody have a clue?

Any answer is really appreciated.

Cheers.

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Dr.Flay
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Re: "HD" skins and server performance

Post by Dr.Flay » Wed Sep 16, 2020 10:31 pm

Welcome to the forum neo2k76
The renderer shouldn't make them look more pixellated unless the configuration is wrong or it is bugged.
Renderer defaults are not great and are set for maximum compatibility not quality.
Where did you get the renderer ?
If it is from Kenties site, it is only a proof of concept version, so the DX10 version may be better.
If it is from ModDB I have no idea as I haven't tried it. I stick with the renderers from OldUnreal
(If you use nVidia GFX then you should be using a modern GL renderer)

It shouldn't effect server performance unless you are sat playing on the server.
However anyone connecting with original renderers will not be able to use the textures if they are sent out.
There is a special way to create compatible textures where the compressed HD bitmap is merged with the plain one. I can't advise on that as I haven't done it. However "MergeDXT GUI" will be your tool of choice.

It is worth noting that UEd2.1 for Unreal 227 and UEd3 fro UT200x are better for making DDS/S3TC texture packs
viewtopic.php?f=5&t=5370&p=61446#p61446
Also many people miss an important step and the textures get the wrong LOD when rendered
viewtopic.php?f=34&t=3981&hilit=s3tc&start=15#p39193

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EvilGrins
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Re: "HD" skins and server performance

Post by EvilGrins » Wed Sep 16, 2020 10:48 pm

Do you mean skin for a default model or a new model?

For the most part skins tend to fit within 256x256, that's the normal size. Unless you're working on a larger model there's no need for larger textures.

Larger ones do happen sometimes, I've seen them used... but given most player models are all about the same size a larger texture doesn't necessarily make it more detailed.
http://unreal-games.livejournal.com/
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medor wrote:Replace Skaarj with EvilGrins :mrgreen:
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neo2k76
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Re: "HD" skins and server performance

Post by neo2k76 » Thu Sep 17, 2020 10:53 am

Hi Dr. Flay,

thx for welcoming me! .-)
Dr.Flay wrote:
Wed Sep 16, 2020 10:31 pm
The renderer shouldn't make them look more pixellated unless the configuration is wrong or it is bugged.
Renderer defaults are not great and are set for maximum compatibility not quality.
Where did you get the renderer ?
If it is from Kenties site, it is only a proof of concept version, so the DX10 version may be better.
If it is from ModDB I have no idea as I haven't tried it. I stick with the renderers from OldUnreal
(If you use nVidia GFX then you should be using a modern GL renderer)
It's - as you guessed - from the ModDB site:
https://www.moddb.com/mods/unreal-direc ... cbu-and-dx
I also installed the height maps:
https://www.moddb.com/mods/unreal-direc ... une-and-dx

I precisely followed the instructions in the readme. There weren't any modification to be made, other than copying files.
The issue occurs in Windows 10 on my virtual machine und Mac OS - that's the system I'm working with.
Under native Windows 10 (the system I use to play UT) the renderer doesn't work at all.
I tried several Direct X drivers, but sadly I didn't get them to work with the renderer. But that's another story .-(

Are you sure, that this pixelation isn't normal with such a renderer?

Here you can see some sample screenshots. The torso texture is the only one I tested, that's why I darkened the rest.

D3D11 renderer (the pixelation is most visible in the lower chest area in front view and on the shoulder plates in side view):
n276 pierce 256x256 dx11.png
n276 pierce 1024x1024 dx11.png
n276 pierce 2048x2048 dx11.png
n276 pierce side view 256x256 dx11.png
n276 pierce side view 1024x1024 dx11.png
n276 pierce side view 2048x2048 dx11.png
Note: I didn't finish optimizing the camp texture after sizing up, so that's where the bright pixels come from.

---

D3D9 renderer (here the pixelation is less obvious):
n276 pierce 256x256 dx9.png
n276 pierce 1024x1024 dx9.png
n276 pierce 2048x2048 dx9.png
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Last edited by neo2k76 on Thu Sep 17, 2020 11:37 am, edited 1 time in total.

neo2k76
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Re: "HD" skins and server performance

Post by neo2k76 » Thu Sep 17, 2020 11:34 am

Here are two standard skins rendered with D3d9 and D3d11 for comparison.
Note: the images need to be clicked upon to see the difference.
Diff_Skin_Resolutiuons__fem_soldier_256x256.png
Diff_Skin_Resolutiuons__fem_soldier_256x256__dx9.png
Diff_Skin_Resolutiuons__fem_cmdo_256x256.png
Diff_Skin_Resolutiuons__fem_cmdo_256x256__dx9.png
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neo2k76
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Re: "HD" skins and server performance

Post by neo2k76 » Thu Sep 17, 2020 11:41 am

Dr.Flay wrote:
Wed Sep 16, 2020 10:31 pm
It shouldn't effect server performance unless you are sat playing on the server.
Just to be sure that I understand you right here:
That is to say, if one would directly play on the machine using the UT installation that is also functioning as the server?

neo2k76
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Re: "HD" skins and server performance

Post by neo2k76 » Thu Sep 17, 2020 11:44 am

Dr.Flay wrote:
Wed Sep 16, 2020 10:31 pm
However anyone connecting with original renderers will not be able to use the textures if they are sent out.
Which one ist the original renderer? The D3d7?

Dr.Flay wrote:
Wed Sep 16, 2020 10:31 pm
There is a special way to create compatible textures where the compressed HD bitmap is merged with the plain one. I can't advise on that as I haven't done it. However "MergeDXT GUI" will be your tool of choice.
Thx for the information. Sounds interesting. I'll have to check this. .-)

Dr.Flay wrote:
Wed Sep 16, 2020 10:31 pm
It is worth noting that UEd2.1 for Unreal 227 and UEd3 fro UT200x are better for making DDS/S3TC texture packs
viewtopic.php?f=5&t=5370&p=61446#p61446
Also many people miss an important step and the textures get the wrong LOD when rendered
viewtopic.php?f=34&t=3981&hilit=s3tc&start=15#p39193
What are DDS texture packs?

neo2k76
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Re: "HD" skins and server performance

Post by neo2k76 » Thu Sep 17, 2020 3:23 pm

EvilGrins wrote:
Wed Sep 16, 2020 10:48 pm
Do you mean skin for a default model or a new model?

For the most part skins tend to fit within 256x256, that's the normal size. Unless you're working on a larger model there's no need for larger textures.

Larger ones do happen sometimes, I've seen them used... but given most player models are all about the same size a larger texture doesn't necessarily make it more detailed.

Hi EvilGrins,

thx for answering. .-)
I'm a bit familiar with making skins for UT99. Just somehow rusty. ,-)
I released some skins to utskins.com back in the years 2000-2001. The first skin I made and at the same time the highest rated skin on utskins.com was "Battlesuit" for the Boss model.

battlesuit_skin.png
Perhaps I'll release an update someday. Not sure right now.

Here's the corresponding rating on utskins.com in the web.archive:
http://web.archive.org/web/200103040354 ... s/bo13.htm

You can download it here:
https://unrealarchive.org/skins/unreal- ... 1ad2a.html

I saw you mentioned it here: viewtopic.php?t=4571



Another skin of mine is the "Bloodreaper" skin.
Even though I didn't put too much effort in it, it was one of my favs.

bloodreaper_skin.png
Here's the corresponding site on utskins.com in the web.archive:
http://web.archive.org/web/200103031312 ... d/sh09.htm

You can download it here:
https://unrealarchive.org/skins/unreal- ... 21a16.html




But enough of that. I just tried the "HD Texture Pack for Unreal Tournament" released by AHaigh01 and made a screenshot of the female soldier skin. Here you can see the difference to the standard skin I posted above:
default soldier HD pack dx9.png

HD texture source:
https://sites.google.com/view/unrealhdtextures/home
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fudgonaut
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Re: "HD" skins and server performance

Post by fudgonaut » Thu Sep 17, 2020 3:40 pm

I remember the Battlesuit and Bloodreaper skins when you first put them out. Some of my favorite work - and part of what inspired me to make (and eventually remake) my Diesel skin, and Octane skin. Thanks for your great work!

neo2k76
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Re: "HD" skins and server performance

Post by neo2k76 » Thu Sep 17, 2020 5:30 pm

Hey fudgonaut! .-))

your answer really made my day! .-)
It's great to hear that someone out there is really remembering some of my stuff! And even more that it inspired you to make some custom skins! .-)

Am I right in assuming, that today no one is anymore interested in custom skins? Since it seems to be all about performing as a player these days!? What do you think?

Cheers, neo

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EvilGrins
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Re: "HD" skins and server performance

Post by EvilGrins » Thu Sep 17, 2020 7:15 pm

neo2k76 wrote:
Thu Sep 17, 2020 3:23 pm
I released some skins to utskins.com back in the years 2000-2001. The first skin I made and at the same time the highest rated skin on utskins.com was "Battlesuit" for the Boss model.
Nice to see someone else remembers UTskins.com, and I'm familiar with that skin.

Although, now that I know you made it I gotta ask... the team color for blue on that boss skin is great but not so much red, green, and yellow. Why'd you not do the same for them?
http://unreal-games.livejournal.com/
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medor wrote:Replace Skaarj with EvilGrins :mrgreen:
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OjitroC
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Re: "HD" skins and server performance

Post by OjitroC » Thu Sep 17, 2020 7:21 pm

neo2k76 wrote:
Thu Sep 17, 2020 5:30 pm
Am I right in assuming, that today no one is anymore interested in custom skins?
Some people on here are interested in custom skins - EG posts his fairly frequently for example.

I use what I can but there are so many and only so many bots (320) one can put them on - I've probably got around 2K custom skins I haven't used yet or even looked at. It's always nice to see new ones though.

The battlesuit skin looks really cool - I don't have that so will get it and try it out.

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EvilGrins
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Re: "HD" skins and server performance

Post by EvilGrins » Thu Sep 17, 2020 7:25 pm

neo2k76 wrote:
Thu Sep 17, 2020 5:30 pm
Am I right in assuming, that today no one is anymore interested in custom skins? Since it seems to be all about performing as a player these days!? What do you think?
I still make them, though it may explain why my skinning contest this year · viewtopic.php?f=1&t=13996 · didn't yield more results.

Going to do another one of those next year, cross your fingers and be sure to come back for it.
http://unreal-games.livejournal.com/
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medor wrote:Replace Skaarj with EvilGrins :mrgreen:
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neo2k76
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Re: "HD" skins and server performance

Post by neo2k76 » Thu Sep 17, 2020 10:32 pm

EvilGrins wrote:
Thu Sep 17, 2020 7:15 pm
Although, now that I know you made it I gotta ask... the team color for blue on that boss skin is great but not so much red, green, and yellow. Why'd you not do the same for them?
The time I made that skin I didn't I play team games with more than two teams. So I thought blue vs black & red would be distinguishable enough for me. ,-)
But since I really like the CTF4 mod I'm considering updating the colors.
The skin I'm currently working on will have a more striking appearance regarding the team colors.

neo2k76
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Re: "HD" skins and server performance

Post by neo2k76 » Thu Sep 17, 2020 10:34 pm

OjitroC wrote:
Thu Sep 17, 2020 7:21 pm
The battlesuit skin looks really cool - I don't have that so will get it and try it out.

Hey OjitroC,

I'm glad you like it. .-)