MH GiranTown

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Re: MH GiranTown

Postby Red_Fist » Sun Jan 14, 2018 12:00 am

Hmm, I will have to check out the wall problem. thanks
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Re: MH GiranTown

Postby EvilGrins » Sun Jan 14, 2018 6:40 am

OjitroC wrote:Did you know that you can shoot through the walls (well, some of them)?

Do you mean the actual walls or the gates while they're still closed?

Been using the Excessive mutator on the map lately. It makes most of the ammo explosive when it hits, practically makes the rocket launcher full auto.
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Re: MH GiranTown

Postby OjitroC » Sun Jan 14, 2018 3:44 pm

EvilGrins wrote: Do you mean the actual walls or the gates while they're still closed?

Through the actual walls - I just tried it again and, in the first courtyard on the left where the krall are, shooting through the back wall of the building or through that courtyard wall results in an attack by the qdemons that are on the other side of the wall, so they're able to get through the 'wall' as well.

I think shooting through the closed gates is, more or less, the only way to do the map as a SP, unless one has very high starting health and a regen.
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Re: MH GiranTown

Postby Red_Fist » Sun Jan 14, 2018 6:46 pm

Not finding it, both mine and Barbies, shot at wall all along and up and down that back wall both sides of house.
The only other thing could be splash damage, but nothing went "through" the wall.
Unless you have some modified thing running that might override Engine-UT defaults is having more splash damage or override the original projectiles or new ones with new weapons, (just a guess)

But this map BSP was built so wrong, and I didn't want to start over completely from the original authors map, so there may be some weird things going on.

The gate movers should be thicker, all I can think is splash damage.
Last edited by Red_Fist on Sun Jan 14, 2018 7:09 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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Re: MH GiranTown

Postby Barbie » Sun Jan 14, 2018 6:58 pm

OjitroC wrote:shooting through the back wall of the building
Do you mean the building with Brush721 in it? I tried it, but could not shoot through any walls.

PS: I used Red_Fist's map MH-GiranTown.unr, size=19102005 Bytes, CRC32=14B9239D
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Re: MH GiranTown

Postby OjitroC » Sun Jan 14, 2018 8:48 pm

Barbie wrote:Do you mean the building with Brush721 in it?
Yes, that's the one.

Red_Fist wrote: Unless you have some modified thing running that might override Engine-UT defaults is having more splash damage or override the original projectiles or new ones with new weapons, (just a guess)
I'm using CSSWeapons and I see from the .ini that I have bBulletPenetration set to true, which means that the weapons can fire through walls and pawns.

So apologies for that, it's down to the projectiles (or at least those from certain of the CSSWeapons) BUT that doesn't explain why, on the two occasions I did it, I was attacked when in the building by the qdemons that I see from UEd are on the other side of the back wall (they didn't come through the back wall of the building but, I assume, through the back wall of courtyard - unless they can jump over?). Not that I'm suggesting any alterations to the map, given the precarious nature of the BSP, it's merely that I am curious as to why that should happen.
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Re: MH GiranTown

Postby Red_Fist » Mon Jan 15, 2018 4:19 am

Well they don't call them qDemons for nothing, LoL

I wish there was a way to stop stuff from going over walls, there is no practical fix other than making the walls taller. But I figure if you are going to cheat (or not) I don't think it can mess up the sequencing, for counters and doors and ending.

I didn't try from inside the house
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Re: MH GiranTown

Postby papercoffee » Mon Jan 15, 2018 5:12 pm

Red_Fist wrote:I wish there was a way to stop stuff from going over walls, there is no practical fix other than making the walls taller. But I figure if you are going to cheat (or not) I don't think it can mess up the sequencing, for counters and doors and ending.

Or you could use blocking actors to keep the monsters in their region.
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Re: MH GiranTown

Postby EvilGrins » Tue Jan 16, 2018 2:54 am

papercoffee wrote:Or you could use blacking actors to keep the monsters in their region.

Monsters mostly do, but the further you get into the map the more gates you leave open behind you.

It's kind of a blessing and a curse. Monsters you haven't gotten to yet have new paths to reach you, and if you get killed you don't have to run all the way back the same long way before as now there's shortcuts open.
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Re: MH GiranTown

Postby Red_Fist » Tue Jan 16, 2018 7:15 pm

I installed that CSS but can't seem to get the weapons, it does show up in the menus. But while looking I did see that checkbox, shoot through walls, now why in the hell would one program that as a feature, :nonono:

Can't even think of a use as a tool, because you would want to know if the wall(s) ARE solid. :wth:

Need to figure out how to get them, or select them, the default weapons just stay with me. it all looks installed, and seems to work, but no weapons.
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Re: MH GiranTown

Postby papercoffee » Tue Jan 16, 2018 8:15 pm

Red_Fist wrote:I installed that CSS but can't seem to get the weapons, it does show up in the menus. But while looking I did see that checkbox, shoot through walls, now why in the hell would one program that as a feature, :nonono:

Can't even think of a use as a tool, because you would want to know if the wall(s) ARE solid. :wth:

It's a normal game mechanic in Counter Strike that a stronger bullet is able to penetrate through thin walls. weaker bullets can only penetrate wooden surfaces. All of this depends on how thick a penetrable surface is. The Half Life engine did check this and you could shoot through thinner wall parts or corners. But when the wall got thicker then 1 virtual meter did even a strong bullet get stuck.
All this checks don't exist in the Unreal engine. Therefore making a weapon shoot through walls is indeed BS in UT.
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Re: MH GiranTown

Postby OjitroC » Tue Jan 16, 2018 8:51 pm

Red_Fist wrote:I installed that CSS but can't seem to get the weapons, it does show up in the menus.

I don't use the CSS mod itself but have put some of the weapons into StuffSwapper. If you don't want to do this, you can summon one or two of the weapons in-game - see the readme for the summons for each weapon.

I didn't actually realise that some of the CSS weapons will shoot through walls until I did it by accident on this map, though that may be the reason I could shoot through the wooden boxes in the MH map EG is editing.

papercoffee wrote: Therefore making a weapon shoot through walls is indeed BS in UT.

Perhaps though it does introduce some degree of reality, which is appropriate to the CSS Weapons - as far as I can tell not all of them can shoot through walls, possibly only the heavier ARs and the machinegun.

NW3's IRPR can indeed shoot through walls and is extremely useful.
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Re: MH GiranTown

Postby papercoffee » Tue Jan 16, 2018 9:21 pm

OjitroC wrote:
papercoffee wrote: Therefore making a weapon shoot through walls is indeed BS in UT.

Perhaps though it does introduce some degree of reality, which is appropriate to the CSS Weapons - as far as I can tell not all of them can shoot through walls, possibly only the heavier ARs and the machinegun.

NW3's IRPR can indeed shoot through walls and is extremely useful.

Yeah but the NW3's IRPR checks itself if a wall is thin enough. Is it too thick can't the beam reach any opponent.

I didn't tested the CS weapons wall-bang ability... have to try it out.
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Re: MH GiranTown

Postby Barbie » Tue Jan 16, 2018 10:09 pm

papercoffee wrote:making a weapon shoot through walls is indeed BS in UT.
Such already exists in BotPack: the Pulse Gun beam shoots through thin walls.
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Re: MH GiranTown

Postby papercoffee » Tue Jan 16, 2018 11:30 pm

Barbie wrote:
papercoffee wrote:making a weapon shoot through walls is indeed BS in UT.
Such already exists in BotPack: the Pulse Gun beam shoots through thin walls.

:shock: Really? Never noticed this.
How thin must the wall be?
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