DM-MountainHomes

Tutorials and discussions about Mapping - Introduce your own ones!
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Feralidragon
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Re: DM-MountainHomes

Post by Feralidragon »

@Deepak O V: Just tested the map itself, and it looks somewhat nice, but the lighting needs a lot more work, since it looks way too bright and flat overall, with no shadows anywhere.
The map has certainly some potential if you add some more stuff to it and work out the lighting, and it's a great map for a 1vs1.

For example, if you set up a sun and have the lighting matching the sun, with the surfaces shadows set to high quality, the map will very likely go from "nice" to "awesome" almost instantly with this change alone.
To give you a small example of the difference this makes overall in a map: http://www.mapraider.com/maps/unreal-to ... /CTF-Mysis


@sektor2111: You probably didn't receive the memo, but:
Spoiler
I am done discussing or debating anything with you since our last exchange on coding matters, as half of what you say and defend is absolute horseshit, and unlike myself and others, you're not willing to admit when you're proven wrong, you don't look at the actual facts and actually barely know how code works as you treat it as some kind of dark magic mojo rather than actual computer science, and due to this you only look at a person who you barely understand, spreading his word as gospel no one should dare to question (making him a disservice on top of it imo), and often implying that everyone other than yourself and him are idiots, when you're the one making very flawed non-sensical experiments and claims trying to prove things which ultimately are simply not true.

And the worse thing about this is that other folks who understand even less than you follow up on your horseshit, creating a chain of misinformation, simply because you made some things which apparently work and are fairly active in the community, without realizing that is actually incredibly easy to make stuff "just work" even in the current state of things, even if not in the best way, and half of what you do is not remotely done the right way to further prove this very fact, which was proven especially after our last exchange.

But one thing I will do at times is to call you up on your BS at one time or another (like here) when it comes to a point where you're just mistreating and misleading developers through word of mouth that you didn't understand yourself at all, and you further prove with your non-sensical "point" questions in your very post, and I am not willing to allow your BS infecting others that easily.
Sometimes you're right, sometimes you're wrong, but in your mind you're always right and everyone else is an idiot, and I am not willing to play chess against a pigeon, not worth my time at all.
sektor2111 wrote:And I will ALWAYS be a fan of those which are able to write some great natives adding things compatible with default UE1 - probably this subject being out of your range
Not only you are wrong for the most part, but I could actually post a couple of links to you proving so, but instead I will just tell you what you tell others and let you search for it in the forum instead. :)

Not that I understand absolutely everything Higor says, I doubt most do anyway, my knowledge in the native side is fairly limited without a doubt and there's vocabulary that I miss from the computer science side of things (mainly from C++ itself) that would allow me to understand some of it, and there have been cases where I also had some sort of misconception about one thing or another that he has proven otherwise, which is very cool as a matter of fact.

But I don't blindly believe what he says without even understanding it nor necessarily agree with him in everything, unlike yourself, especially when it comes to some of his written code (mainly on the UScript side), instead I just test things out independently and try to actually understand it with critical spirit, which everyone should do regardless of what one person says, this is called peer-reviewing, probably a foreign concept to you.

I mean, if I said anything here which is not right, anyone is free to come along and correct me and explain it, be it either Higor or even a complete noob at this which happened to stumble onto something that I was not aware of, I don't care who, everyone wins.
What you do is the very opposite.

As for your other points, they're completely non-sensical as usual, and you go out of your way to explain a problem with a cause which is just wrong and that has absolutely nothing to do with the problem itself, thank you for providing me with more of such material to have more examples to point to.

For example, for your 3rd point: the brush builder has nothing to do with the brush being subtractive or additive, this is like the 1st grade equivalent of UE1, even new mappers can easily understand this and see how what you're showing has nothing to do with whether or not a subtractive terrain is problematic.
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Deepu
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Re: DM-MountainHomes

Post by Deepu »

Thanks for your information about this map, I will look through it and I will try to fix all things for my next map release...
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makemeunreal
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Re: DM-MountainHomes

Post by makemeunreal »

For me it was 10 out of 10. it could've used a bit more plants and trees. ;) :P :D Thanks for taking your time and building this map.
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Re: DM-MountainHomes

Post by Gustavo6046 »

My bad, sektor, but that is not the terrain brush. That is the community TerainEx brush builder. The default one does align to the grid, but you need to sculpt it manually, because it builds a cube, but with the floor subdivided into many triangles so you can sculpt it. Shut the fuck up. YOU come with a good map, instead of fixing someone else's map, THEN we talk.
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Re: DM-MountainHomes

Post by papercoffee »

@Gustavo6046 no insults.
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sektor2111
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Re: DM-MountainHomes

Post by sektor2111 »

Gustavo6046 wrote:Shut the .. blah.. blah.. moo..
Seriously, do you really need more head knocking ? For your knowledge, I HAVE done maps, as poorly decorated as they are ALL of them are working, read again, are working without vX, fixX, finalFix4, etc. From that work I've learned what a bad brush does, else I wouldn't talk and that's why I'm looking at some terrain stuff for figuring the "HowTo" from those doing them well because I want to learn this mapping too, so I DID NOT DO any terrain modifications. As another sample, I could not learn nothing from your samples (or the multi-sample of the same map), and I'm serious not sad. Here I was mentioning Sky-Box, the rest is good for me as it is, all right, I've redone paths because Editor does trash over there, and... now I can use this type of level and for this reason I have to say THANKS to Deepak O V for this map. As for more mapping, this work is not that entertaining for me - with other words I'm not very loving Editor, community already has maps, many maps, but many of them do needs some love, that's the point.
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Re: DM-MountainHomes

Post by Red_Fist »

I did not look, but plants and more foliage and lighting, for a simple looking outside map, better atmosphere would be a good thing. Maybe add some rock chunks around for the hill sides to break it up a bit.
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Gustavo6046
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Re: DM-MountainHomes

Post by Gustavo6046 »

sektor2111 wrote:I HAVE done maps,
Can you link one? I'd like to see what have you done. It is way better to have a fun and creative map with a few bugs, than a map that is no fun (even if it has zero bugs). No map is rid of BSP issues, and similarly, no code is perfect. Heck, UT99 is very, VERY far from perfect, yet you play it like no other game!


And, papercoffee, I am very discontent with the way @sektor2111 tries to impose his criticisms, and his bloated lies. I will digest what Ferali said: he is part of the exact reason mappers release thousands of fixes, final fixes, et al, for the same map. Misinformation and lack of engine knowledge are heavily tied together (blame Epic for making the engine closed source, too), and they are top of the rank for stupid maps and mods.

Higor is an awesome man, he made XC_Engine. That with no doubt. But he doesn't know everything about UT. None of us do. We should not follow him in a blind manner; we must know what we read, and UNDERSTAND it, before sharing it all around. sektor clearly demonstrated he doesn't know the basics of CSG.
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Re: DM-MountainHomes

Post by papercoffee »

Gustavo6046 I understand you. But please try to keep the conversation on a polite level. This counts for everyone btw.
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Re: DM-MountainHomes

Post by Gustavo6046 »

papercoffee wrote:But please try to keep the conversation on a polite level.
I am trying; no insult was meant there.
"Everyone is an idea man. Everybody thinks they have a revolutionary new game concept that no one else has ever thought of. Having cool ideas will rarely get you anywhere in the games industry. You have to be able to implement your ideas or provide some useful skill. Never join a project whose idea man or leader has no obvious development skills. Never join a project that only has a web designer. You have your own ideas. Focus on them carefully and in small chunks and you will be able to develop cool projects."

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Re: DM-MountainHomes

Post by papercoffee »

Gustavo6046 wrote:
papercoffee wrote:But please try to keep the conversation on a polite level.
I am trying; no insult was meant there.
Thank you.
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sektor2111
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Re: DM-MountainHomes

Post by sektor2111 »

Also politely let's reconfigure the task.
Gustavo6046 wrote:and his bloated lies
THESE things are specific to your league closer to your age not to me, I worked some hours in Editor so I could see what's here and there in big parts, not all details, but enough to almost demotivate me from using it daily and to not develop any whatever master plans...
Gustavo6046 wrote:I will digest what Ferali said: he is part of the exact reason mappers release thousands of fixes, final fixes, et al, for the same map.
Then you can try to digest this: They are releasing files for more pain for admins hosting servers as long as THEY DO NOT TEST what they do, btw, ignoring testing and logs it's the default wrong route, the part with knowledge it's the second part for which everyone has issues - including me, but this doesn't mean you cannot see very good maps at MapRaider, that simple. Old farts making maps in 1999-2002+ were testing a Level multiple times before spreading over-fixes - just check titles and see how many have these "great" suffixes/prefixes. This was a new dumb mapping class post 2010 - 2012 if memory doesn't cheat me in hoping to not wrong, or even earlier probably for an un-existent announced supposed End-Of-World which has never came in 2012 and admins from community could figure a sudden sh!t-maps explosion, just spreading junks for no purpose as long as were bugged the mostly Un-Tested properly and making them to get mad at sorting out good maps outta that trash-box - yeah, this is the whole truth for another digesting task. Probably you need evidences in how many maps have fix1 to fix5 and even beta before, and still crapped up, checkout MH collections as a sample - and you can re-read Barbie's posting toward this subject; for this reason I went at fixing as long as all these years NOTHING was fixed or detecting intentions for fixing those maps. Terrains mapping is one of my last goals.

The reason for adding this map into my gaming ground and not only mine it's because this map seems good compared with others that's why Deepak O V earned my respect - not sure why he did paths with Editor but this is not a major problem.

My links, were you asking ? Well, I had those in my signature a few months ago, but I'm not bother to put them back. Whoever knows my pages, signatures from elsewhere, can figure what I did and when. So far I'm busy with sorting stuff, writing various patch files, these are time consuming. The rest of my home jobs are Off-Topic here - I'm looking at some Android stuff for personal reasons, another time consuming and here we do have a day with only 24 hours, not enough for everything.
Last edited by sektor2111 on Sun Sep 02, 2018 11:29 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Gustavo6046
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Re: DM-MountainHomes

Post by Gustavo6046 »

Okay. I agree with you that there are way too many crap maps. But you can't usually blame mappers - some of they, including myself in my earlier days of UnrealEd, simply didn't have as much knowledge in the Unreal Editor, and would simply throw together a bunch of brushes, plop a few actors, and call it a day. It was bland, ugly, it was not fun. But we were novices. Every experienced mapper was a novice at some point in the past.

But I still didn't get one thing.

This map has several lighting and pathing issues. Mine has a few BSP errors, but nice pathing, and good lighting. Yet, you don't keep mine, but you keep his! Is that some sort of bias?
"Everyone is an idea man. Everybody thinks they have a revolutionary new game concept that no one else has ever thought of. Having cool ideas will rarely get you anywhere in the games industry. You have to be able to implement your ideas or provide some useful skill. Never join a project whose idea man or leader has no obvious development skills. Never join a project that only has a web designer. You have your own ideas. Focus on them carefully and in small chunks and you will be able to develop cool projects."

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sektor2111
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Re: DM-MountainHomes

Post by sektor2111 »

Yours will be the next on list but first let's clarify some problems (maybe mentioned before and ignored):
- Skybox has annoying lines like a bullet has broke it in the middle - excuse me, but I do not have such things in my lousy design from MH-Sk_Godz or elsewhere speaking about Transform Permanently debated in some earlier posting;
- your paths... eh... I said that BlockedPath it's useless in your context - FearSpot has not purpose and BioRifle is screwed up at collision for no reason - is this a sort of bugging Bot on purpose ? Disagree. PathNodes buried or higher located and out of ledges completely unreachable ?;
- That ledge around some cave, it looks like a BSP created on purpose, Bots killed me quickly there because I was skating in that spot, that one also has visual borks;
- In my country the sun is usually behind the clouds not in front of them and not that big to bleed my eyes;
- There is also a "portal" loading the map processing and not being a portal as long as it's too small - this is just useless.

When these are going changed, I'll drop it instantly in Monster Gaming Server and my Home Server, Open Area type maps are welcomed for me, matching monster combat ambience, so I do not have problems with loading your map, but the content do needs some revision. For those geometry problems, you know what you did so I do not intend to ruin things over there - it's your task.
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Gustavo6046
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Re: DM-MountainHomes

Post by Gustavo6046 »

Like this? (the ladder was not verified for network play)
"Everyone is an idea man. Everybody thinks they have a revolutionary new game concept that no one else has ever thought of. Having cool ideas will rarely get you anywhere in the games industry. You have to be able to implement your ideas or provide some useful skill. Never join a project whose idea man or leader has no obvious development skills. Never join a project that only has a web designer. You have your own ideas. Focus on them carefully and in small chunks and you will be able to develop cool projects."

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