Crediting others for their work is important...

Tutorials and discussions about Mapping - Introduce your own ones!
User avatar
OjitroC
Godlike
Posts: 3605
Joined: Sat Sep 12, 2015 8:46 pm

Re: Crediting others for their work is important...

Post by OjitroC »

TheDane wrote: Fri Jun 19, 2020 12:29 pmI'm sorry, but I don't follow your logic here? You agree to it refering back to 1998 as Unreal Engine, but still seem fairly convinced that it refers to the current version of the engine? The current version doesn't go back to 1998, only UE1 does?

I agree that this new EULA is indeed tricky, and EACH AND EVERY prior EULA has been completely removed from EPIC's websites, and they have NOT replied to my previous attempts to clear this out, by mail nor their forums, so.....??

But, legaly, you should abide by this EULA, since it's the ONLY one accessable at the moment, and because it refers to Unreal Ungine unnumbered - dating back to 1998.
There's a lot that could be said but the principle reason why this EULA can not be said to cover previous iterations of the Unreal Engine is that, because so much of it obviously and explicity deals with the current iteration, it would be left to the individual to decide what exactly in the EULA applies to previous Engines - that is an unsound basis on which to enter into an Agreement, leaving it up to one party to decide what applies to them. Furthemore it is stated that "[T]he License becomes effective on the date you accept this Agreement or download the Engine Code or any Content. The License does not grant you any title or ownership in the Licensed Technology" which is “any or all of the Engine Code and the Content, including as modified by you under the License" (Engine Code being the Source Code of the Engine). As stated before, individuals are not able to download the Engine Source Code for UEngine 1 and so again it can be argued that this EULA does not apply to previous versions of the Unreal Engine.

As I said before, I do not think, firstly, it is legally possible to retrospectively alter the terms of an EULA and, secondly if it were, to do so without making significant efforts to inform those affected by the alterations (there would be no point in such an alteration without publicity as no one would know about it and so it would have no practical effect).

Context is another important thing of course - this EULA appears on a website totally devoted to the latest iteration of the Engine. Everything in the EULA relates to the current Engine, to how the Source Code can be obtained and how it is to be used. This would lead a reasonable person to conclude that the EULA relates to the current Unreal Engine and, moreover, there is nothing in that EULA which indicates that it does apply to other iterations of the Engine.

1998 refers to the year in which the Unreal Engine was first copyrighted and when presumably those terms were also registered as a trademark. Presumably the current Engine is subsumed in that copyright but that is not the same thing as the current EULA covering previous iterations of the Engine.

As you rightly say, Epic provide no information about EULAs relating to previous iterations, except in relation to the UDK for nos 2 and 3 but not for Engine no 1. There appear to be few sources for information on this though the original Unreal Manual does, I think, contain an EULA for that game. I have seen a very short and cursory EULA relating to UT99 in one of the UT wikis.

So sorry to disagree but legally one is bound by the EULA relating to UT99 and by no other later or subsequent EULA.
User avatar
EvilGrins
Godlike
Posts: 9668
Joined: Thu Jun 30, 2011 8:12 pm
Personal rank: God of Fudge
Location: Palo Alto, CA
Contact:

Re: Crediting others for their work is important...

Post by EvilGrins »

TheDane wrote: Thu Jun 18, 2020 9:00 pmCreditting is not sufficient according to the Unreal Engine EULA
I suppose I could also throw each mapper a parade, but that seems a bit much.
TourianTourist wrote: Thu Jun 18, 2020 5:59 pmYeah, this. Not sure what you mean, though, by "beat you to it".
Only meant someone else had already edited that map.
OjitroC wrote: Thu Jun 18, 2020 3:10 pmOh well, that is odd - I have tried different renderers but with the same result.
Okay, try them on this. Maybe going with my edit makes a difference, or maybe not.

Additionally, I've gotta work out how to correctly setup defense points.
Attachments
CTF-UTDMT-Tundra-WIP.zip
(941.12 KiB) Downloaded 11 times
http://unreal-games.livejournal.com/
Image
medor wrote:Replace Skaarj with EvilGrins :mrgreen:
Smilies · viewtopic.php?f=8&t=13758
User avatar
OjitroC
Godlike
Posts: 3605
Joined: Sat Sep 12, 2015 8:46 pm

Re: Crediting others for their work is important...

Post by OjitroC »

As a matter of interest, this is the EULA for Unreal - at least for the version sold in the USA, there are variations depending on region so that, for example, another one indicates that the Agreement is governed by English law
Spoiler
END-USER LICENSE AGREEMENT
PLEASE READ CAREFULLY. BY USING OR INSTALLING THIS SOFTWARE, OR BY PLACING OR COPYING THIS SOFTWARE ON YOUR COMPUTER HARDWARE, COMPUTER RAM OR OTHER STORAGE MEDIUM, YOU ARE AGREEING TO BE BOUND BY THE TERMS OF THIS LICENSE. IF YOU DO NOT AGREE TO THESE TERMS, PROMPTLY RETURN THE PRODUCT IN ITS PACK- AGING TO THE PLACE WHERE YOU OBTAINED IT.
1. License. The software accompanying this license (the “Software”) and the related documen- tation are licensed to you by us and are subject to this license. If the Software is configured for loading onto a hard drive, you may so load the Software only onto the hard drive of a sin- gle computer and run the Software off only that hard drive. You may not delete the copyright notices or any other proprietary legends on the original copy of the Software. If there is an editor incorporated into the Software, this license is also subject to Section 8 below. You agree that the Software will not be shipped, transferred or exported into any country in violation of the U.S. Export Administration Act (or any other law governing such matters) by you or any- one at your direction and that you will not utilize and will not authorize anyone to utilize, in any other manner, the Software in violation of any applicable law. The Software may not be downloaded or otherwise exported or reexported into (or to a national or resident of) any country to which the U.S. has embargoed goods or to anyone or into any country who/which are prohibited by applicable law, from receiving such property.
2. Restrictions. The Software contains copyrighted material, trade secrets and other proprietary material. You may not decompile, modify reverse engineer, publicly display, prepare deriva- tive works based on the Software (except as permitted in Section 8, below), disassemble or otherwise reproduce the Software. You may not rent, sell, lease, sublicense or distribute the Software. You may not offer the Software on a pay-per-play basis or otherwise commercially exploit the Software or use the Software for any commercial purpose. You may not electron- ically transmit the Software from one computer to another or over a network.
3. Termination. This license is effective until terminated. You may terminate this license at any time by destroying the Software and related documentation. This license will terminate imme- diately without notice from us if you fail to comply with any provision of this license. Upon termination, you must destroy the Software and related documentation.
4. Disclaimer of Warranty on Software. You are aware and agree that use of the Software and the media on which it is recorded are at your sole risk. The Software, related documen- tation and the media are provided “AS IS”. Unless otherwise provided by applicable law, GT Interactive Software Corp. (“GT”) warrants to the original purchaser of this product that the Software storage medium will be free from defects in material and workmanship under nor- mal use for ninety (90) days from the date of purchase. This warranty is void if the defect has arisen through accident, abuse, neglect or misapplication. GT AND EPIC MEGAGAMES, INC. (“EPIC”) EXPRESSLY DISCLAIM ALL OTHER WARRANTIES, EXPRESS OR IMPLIED, INCLUD- ING BUT NOT LIMITED TO, THE IMPLIED WARRANTIES OF MERCHANTABILITY AND FIT- NESS FOR A PARTICULAR PURPOSE. WE DO NOT WARRANT THAT THE FUNCTIONS CON- TAINED IN THE SOFTWARE WILL MEET YOUR REQUIREMENTS, NO ORAL OR WRITTEN INFORMATION OR ADVICE GIVEN BY US OR ANY OF OUR AUTHORIZED REPRESENTA- TIVES SHALL CREATE A WARRANTY OR IN ANY WAY INCREASE THE SCOPE OF THIS WAR- RANTY. SOME JURISDICTIONS DO NOT ALLOW THE EXCLUSION OF IMPLIED WAR- RANTIES, SO THE ABOVE EXCLUSIONS MAY NOT APPLY TO YOU.
5.LimitationofLiability. UNDERNOCIRCUMSTANCES,INCLUDING,WITHOUTLIMITATION, NEGLIGENCE, SHALL GT, EPIC OR ANY OF THEIR RESPECTIVE OFFICERS. EMPLOYEES, DIRECTORS, AGENTS, LICENSEES, SUBLICENSEE OR ASSIGNS BE LIABLE FOR ANY INCI- DENTAL, SPECIAL OR CONSEQUENTIAL DAMAGES THAT RESULT FROM THE USE OR INABILITY TO USE THE SOFTWARE OR RELATED DOCUMENTATION, EVEN IF SUCH PARTIES HAVE BEEN ADVISED OF THE POSSIBILITY OF THOSE DAMAGES. SOME JURISDICTIONS DO NOT ALLOW THE LIMITATION OR EXCLUSION OF LIABILITY FOR INCIDENTAL OR CON- SEQUENTIAL DAMAGES SO THE ABOVE LIMITATION OR EXCLUSION MAY NOT APPLY TO YOU. In no event shall our total liability to you for all damages, losses, and causes of action (whether in contract, tort or otherwise) exceed the amount paid by you for the Software.
30 NC114-85ELKS
6. Controlling Law and Severability. This license shall be governed by and construed in accordance with the laws of the State of New York, USA. Exclusive venue for all litigation shall be in New York, New York. If any provision of this license is unenforceable, the rest of it shall remain in effect.
7. Complete Agreement. This license constitutes the entire agreement between the parties with respect to the use of the Software and the related documentation.
8. Editor and End-user Variations. (a) The Software includes a Beta version of the upcoming Unreal Level Editor. An “Editor”
is a feature which allows you to modify the Software or to construct new variations for use with it. These modifications and variations can be both playable and non-playable. An Editor includes its associated tools and utilities. An Editor is NOT shareware. You may not freely distribute it to any BBS, CD, floppy or any other media. You may not sell it or repackage it for sale. The final version of the Editor will be released as a sep- arate product along with its own manual and additional features. Because the enclosed beta version is not the final version of the Editor, it may contain bugs or glitches which may affect the successful creation and operation of levels and other functions. This beta version of the Editor has been included to show the potential of the final version of the Editor. Technical support is not available from GT or Epic for the beta version of the Editor.
(b) Using the Editor, you may create modifications or enhancements to the Software, including the construction of new levels (collectively referred to as “Variations”), subject to the following restrictions:
i.
ii. iii.
iv. v.
Your Variations must only work with the full, registered copy of the Software, not independently or with any other software.
Your Variations must not contain modifications to any executable file. Your Variations must not contain any libelous, defamatory, or other illegal material, material that is scandalous or invades the rights of privacy or publicity of any third party, or contains any trademarks, copyright-protected work, or other recognizable property of third parties. Your variations shall not be supported by GT Interactive Software Corp., The WizardWorks Group, Inc., or any of such parties affiliates and subsidiaries.”
Your Variations must be distributed solely for free. Neither you nor any other person or party may sell them to anyone, commercially exploit them in any way, or charge anyone for using them without a license from Epic. You may, however, exchange them at no charge among other end-users and distribute them to others over the Internet for free.
vi. The prohibitions and restrictions in this section apply to anyone in possession of the Software or any of your Variations.
9. Copyright. The Software and all copyrights, trademarks and all other conceivable intellectu- al property rights related to the Software are owned by GT or its licensors and are protected by United States copyrights laws, international treaty provisions and all applicable law, such as the Lanham Act. You must treat the Software like any other copyrighted material, as required by 17 U.S.C. section 101 et seq. and other applicable law. You agree that you are receiving a copy of the Software by license only and not by sale and that the “first sale” doc- trine of 17 U.S.C. section 109 does not apply to your receipt or use of the Software.Please do not make unauthorized copies. The program you’ve purchase was produced through the efforts of many people who earn their livelihood from its lawful use. Don’t make copies for other who have not paid for the right to use it. To report copyright violations to the Software Publishers Association, call 1-800-388-PIR8 or write:
Software Publishers Association 1101 Connecticut Ave., Suite 901 NW Washington, DC 20036
This program is protected by United States federal and international copyright laws. All trademarks mentioned in this manual are the property of their respective owners.
This is the EULA for the Dreamcast version of UT99 which seems to be much the same as the EULA for UT99 GOTY - it's important to note "This license (including any addendum or amendment to this license which is included with the Software) constitutes the entire agreement between you and Infogrames with respect to the use of the Software and the support services (if any) and they supersede all prior or contemporaneous oral or written communications and representations with respect to the Software or any other subject matter covered by this license" which would lead a reasonable person to conclude that the Agreement was and would not be subject to SUBSEQUENT amendment.
Spoiler
END-USER LICENSE AGREEMENT PLEASE READ CAREFULLY. BY USING THIS SDFTWARE, YOU ARE AGREEING TO BE BOUND BY THE TERMS OF THIS END-USER LICENSE AGREEMENT ("LICENSE"li. IF YOU DO NOT AGREE TO THESE TERMS, DO NOT USE THE SOFTWARE AND PROMPTLY RETURN THE DISC OR CARTRIDGE IN ITS ORIGINAL PACKAGING TO THE PLACE OF PURCHASE.
1. Grant of License. The software accompanying this iicense and reiated documentation (the "Software") is iicensed to you, not soid, by Infogrames, inc. ("infogrames"), and its use is subject to this iicense. infogrames grants to you a iimited, personai, non-exciusive right to use the Software in the manner described in the user documentation. If the Software is configured for loading onto a hard drive, you may load the Software only onto the hard drive of a single machine and run the Software from only that hard drive. You may permanently transfer all rights Infogrames grants to you in this license, provided you retain no copies, you transfer all of the Software (including all component parts, the media and printed materials, and any upgrades), and the recipient reads and accepts this license. Infogrames reserves all rights not expressly granted to you by this Agreement.
2. Restrictions, infogrames or its suppliers own the title, copyright, and other intellectual property rights in the Software. The Software contains copyrighted material, trade secrets and other proprietary material. You may not delete the copyright notices or any other proprietary legends on the original copy of the Software. You may not decompile, modify, reverse engineer, disassemble or otherwise reproduce the Software. You may not copy, rent, lease, sublicense or distribute the Software. You may not electronically transmit the Software from one computer, console or other platform to another or over a network. Any attempt to transfer any of the rights, duties or obligations hereunder is void,
3. Termination. This License is effective until terminated. You may terminate this License at any time by destroying the Software. This License will terminate immediately without notice from Infogrames if you fail to comply with any provision of this license. Upon termination, you must destroy the Software. 4. Disclaimer of Warranty on Software. You are aware and agree that use of the Software and the media on which it is recorded is at your sole risk. The Software and the mediaare provided "AS IS.' Unless otherwise provided by applicable law, Infogrames warrants to the original purchaser of this product that the Software storage medium will be free from defects of materials and workmanship for ninety (90) days from the date of purchase. This warranty is void it the defect has arisen through accident, abuse, neglect or misapplication. INFOGRAMES EXPRESSLY DISCLAIMS ALL OTHER WARRANTIES, EXPRESS OR IMPLIED, INCLUDING, BUT NOT LIMITED TO, THE IMPLIED WARRANTIES OF MERCHANTABILITY AND FITNESS FOR A PARTICULAR PURPOSE. INFOGRAMES DOES NOT WARRANT THAT THE FUNCTIONS CONTAINED IN THE SOFTWARE WILL MEET YOUR REQUIREMENTS. NO ORAL OR WRITTEN INFORMATION OR ADVICE GIVEN BY INFOGRAMES OR ANY INFOGRAMES-AUTHORIZED REPRESENTATIVE SHALL
CREATE A WARRANTY OR IN ANY WAY INCREASE THE SCOPE OF THIS WARRANTY. SOME JURISOICTIONS DO NOT ALLOW THE EXCLUSION OF IMPLIED WARRANTIES, SO THE ABOVE EXCLUSIONS MAY NOT APPLY TO YOU. 5. Limitation of Liability, UNDER NO CIRCUMSTANCES, INCLUDING NEGLIGENCE.SHALL INFOGRAMES BE LIABLE FOR ANY INCIDENTAL, SPECIAL OR CONSEQUENTIAL DAMAGES IN CONNECTION WITH THE SOFTWARE, INCLUDING THOSE THAT RESULT FROM THE USE OF OR INABILITY TO USE THE SOFTWARE, EVEN IF INFOGRAMES HAS BEEN ADVISED OF THE POSSIBILITY OF THOSE DAMAGES. IN NO EVENT SHALL INFOGRAME’S TOTAL LIABILITY TO YOU FOR ALL DAMAGES, LOSSES AND CAUSES OF ACTION (WHETHER IN CONTRACT, TORT OR OTHERWISE) EXCEED THE AMOUNT PAID BY YOU FOR THE SOFTWARE. SOME JURIS- DICTIONS DO NOT ALLOW THE LIMITATION OR EXCLUSION OF LIABILITY FOR INCIDENTAL OR CONSEQUENTIAL DAMAGES, SO THE ABOVE LIMITATION OR EXCLUSION MAY NOT APPLY TO YOU.
6. Miscellaneous. This license shall be governed by and construed in accordance with the laws of the State of New York, USA, exclu- sive of its choice of law and/or contliots of law jurisprudence; and, in respect of any dispute which may arise hereunder, you consent to the jurisdiction of the federal and state courts of New York County, New York. If any provision of this license is unenforceable, the rest of it shall remain in effect. This license (including any addendum or amendment to this license which is included with the Software) constitutes the entire agreement between you and Infogrames with respect to the use of the Software and the support services (if any) and they supersede all prior or contemporaneous oral or written communications and representations with respect to the Software or any other subject matter covered by this license.
User avatar
TheDane
Masterful
Posts: 660
Joined: Tue Feb 12, 2008 2:47 pm
Personal rank: Happy fool :-)

Re: Crediting others for their work is important...

Post by TheDane »

OjitroC wrote: Fri Jun 19, 2020 2:04 pm As a matter of interest, this is the EULA for Unreal - at least for the version sold in the USA, there are variations depending on region so that, for example, another one indicates that the Agreement is governed by English law
Spoiler
END-USER LICENSE AGREEMENT
PLEASE READ CAREFULLY. BY USING OR INSTALLING THIS SOFTWARE, OR BY PLACING OR COPYING THIS SOFTWARE ON YOUR COMPUTER HARDWARE, COMPUTER RAM OR OTHER STORAGE MEDIUM, YOU ARE AGREEING TO BE BOUND BY THE TERMS OF THIS LICENSE. IF YOU DO NOT AGREE TO THESE TERMS, PROMPTLY RETURN THE PRODUCT IN ITS PACK- AGING TO THE PLACE WHERE YOU OBTAINED IT.
1. License. The software accompanying this license (the “Software”) and the related documen- tation are licensed to you by us and are subject to this license. If the Software is configured for loading onto a hard drive, you may so load the Software only onto the hard drive of a sin- gle computer and run the Software off only that hard drive. You may not delete the copyright notices or any other proprietary legends on the original copy of the Software. If there is an editor incorporated into the Software, this license is also subject to Section 8 below. You agree that the Software will not be shipped, transferred or exported into any country in violation of the U.S. Export Administration Act (or any other law governing such matters) by you or any- one at your direction and that you will not utilize and will not authorize anyone to utilize, in any other manner, the Software in violation of any applicable law. The Software may not be downloaded or otherwise exported or reexported into (or to a national or resident of) any country to which the U.S. has embargoed goods or to anyone or into any country who/which are prohibited by applicable law, from receiving such property.
2. Restrictions. The Software contains copyrighted material, trade secrets and other proprietary material. You may not decompile, modify reverse engineer, publicly display, prepare deriva- tive works based on the Software (except as permitted in Section 8, below), disassemble or otherwise reproduce the Software. You may not rent, sell, lease, sublicense or distribute the Software. You may not offer the Software on a pay-per-play basis or otherwise commercially exploit the Software or use the Software for any commercial purpose. You may not electron- ically transmit the Software from one computer to another or over a network.
3. Termination. This license is effective until terminated. You may terminate this license at any time by destroying the Software and related documentation. This license will terminate imme- diately without notice from us if you fail to comply with any provision of this license. Upon termination, you must destroy the Software and related documentation.
4. Disclaimer of Warranty on Software. You are aware and agree that use of the Software and the media on which it is recorded are at your sole risk. The Software, related documen- tation and the media are provided “AS IS”. Unless otherwise provided by applicable law, GT Interactive Software Corp. (“GT”) warrants to the original purchaser of this product that the Software storage medium will be free from defects in material and workmanship under nor- mal use for ninety (90) days from the date of purchase. This warranty is void if the defect has arisen through accident, abuse, neglect or misapplication. GT AND EPIC MEGAGAMES, INC. (“EPIC”) EXPRESSLY DISCLAIM ALL OTHER WARRANTIES, EXPRESS OR IMPLIED, INCLUD- ING BUT NOT LIMITED TO, THE IMPLIED WARRANTIES OF MERCHANTABILITY AND FIT- NESS FOR A PARTICULAR PURPOSE. WE DO NOT WARRANT THAT THE FUNCTIONS CON- TAINED IN THE SOFTWARE WILL MEET YOUR REQUIREMENTS, NO ORAL OR WRITTEN INFORMATION OR ADVICE GIVEN BY US OR ANY OF OUR AUTHORIZED REPRESENTA- TIVES SHALL CREATE A WARRANTY OR IN ANY WAY INCREASE THE SCOPE OF THIS WAR- RANTY. SOME JURISDICTIONS DO NOT ALLOW THE EXCLUSION OF IMPLIED WAR- RANTIES, SO THE ABOVE EXCLUSIONS MAY NOT APPLY TO YOU.
5.LimitationofLiability. UNDERNOCIRCUMSTANCES,INCLUDING,WITHOUTLIMITATION, NEGLIGENCE, SHALL GT, EPIC OR ANY OF THEIR RESPECTIVE OFFICERS. EMPLOYEES, DIRECTORS, AGENTS, LICENSEES, SUBLICENSEE OR ASSIGNS BE LIABLE FOR ANY INCI- DENTAL, SPECIAL OR CONSEQUENTIAL DAMAGES THAT RESULT FROM THE USE OR INABILITY TO USE THE SOFTWARE OR RELATED DOCUMENTATION, EVEN IF SUCH PARTIES HAVE BEEN ADVISED OF THE POSSIBILITY OF THOSE DAMAGES. SOME JURISDICTIONS DO NOT ALLOW THE LIMITATION OR EXCLUSION OF LIABILITY FOR INCIDENTAL OR CON- SEQUENTIAL DAMAGES SO THE ABOVE LIMITATION OR EXCLUSION MAY NOT APPLY TO YOU. In no event shall our total liability to you for all damages, losses, and causes of action (whether in contract, tort or otherwise) exceed the amount paid by you for the Software.
30 NC114-85ELKS
6. Controlling Law and Severability. This license shall be governed by and construed in accordance with the laws of the State of New York, USA. Exclusive venue for all litigation shall be in New York, New York. If any provision of this license is unenforceable, the rest of it shall remain in effect.
7. Complete Agreement. This license constitutes the entire agreement between the parties with respect to the use of the Software and the related documentation.
8. Editor and End-user Variations. (a) The Software includes a Beta version of the upcoming Unreal Level Editor. An “Editor”
is a feature which allows you to modify the Software or to construct new variations for use with it. These modifications and variations can be both playable and non-playable. An Editor includes its associated tools and utilities. An Editor is NOT shareware. You may not freely distribute it to any BBS, CD, floppy or any other media. You may not sell it or repackage it for sale. The final version of the Editor will be released as a sep- arate product along with its own manual and additional features. Because the enclosed beta version is not the final version of the Editor, it may contain bugs or glitches which may affect the successful creation and operation of levels and other functions. This beta version of the Editor has been included to show the potential of the final version of the Editor. Technical support is not available from GT or Epic for the beta version of the Editor.
(b) Using the Editor, you may create modifications or enhancements to the Software, including the construction of new levels (collectively referred to as “Variations”), subject to the following restrictions:
i.
ii. iii.
iv. v.
Your Variations must only work with the full, registered copy of the Software, not independently or with any other software.
Your Variations must not contain modifications to any executable file. Your Variations must not contain any libelous, defamatory, or other illegal material, material that is scandalous or invades the rights of privacy or publicity of any third party, or contains any trademarks, copyright-protected work, or other recognizable property of third parties. Your variations shall not be supported by GT Interactive Software Corp., The WizardWorks Group, Inc., or any of such parties affiliates and subsidiaries.”
Your Variations must be distributed solely for free. Neither you nor any other person or party may sell them to anyone, commercially exploit them in any way, or charge anyone for using them without a license from Epic. You may, however, exchange them at no charge among other end-users and distribute them to others over the Internet for free.
vi. The prohibitions and restrictions in this section apply to anyone in possession of the Software or any of your Variations.
9. Copyright. The Software and all copyrights, trademarks and all other conceivable intellectu- al property rights related to the Software are owned by GT or its licensors and are protected by United States copyrights laws, international treaty provisions and all applicable law, such as the Lanham Act. You must treat the Software like any other copyrighted material, as required by 17 U.S.C. section 101 et seq. and other applicable law. You agree that you are receiving a copy of the Software by license only and not by sale and that the “first sale” doc- trine of 17 U.S.C. section 109 does not apply to your receipt or use of the Software.Please do not make unauthorized copies. The program you’ve purchase was produced through the efforts of many people who earn their livelihood from its lawful use. Don’t make copies for other who have not paid for the right to use it. To report copyright violations to the Software Publishers Association, call 1-800-388-PIR8 or write:
Software Publishers Association 1101 Connecticut Ave., Suite 901 NW Washington, DC 20036
This program is protected by United States federal and international copyright laws. All trademarks mentioned in this manual are the property of their respective owners.
This is the EULA for the Dreamcast version of UT99 which seems to be much the same as the EULA for UT99 GOTY - it's important to note "This license (including any addendum or amendment to this license which is included with the Software) constitutes the entire agreement between you and Infogrames with respect to the use of the Software and the support services (if any) and they supersede all prior or contemporaneous oral or written communications and representations with respect to the Software or any other subject matter covered by this license" which would lead a reasonable person to conclude that the Agreement was and would not be subject to SUBSEQUENT amendment.
Spoiler
END-USER LICENSE AGREEMENT PLEASE READ CAREFULLY. BY USING THIS SDFTWARE, YOU ARE AGREEING TO BE BOUND BY THE TERMS OF THIS END-USER LICENSE AGREEMENT ("LICENSE"li. IF YOU DO NOT AGREE TO THESE TERMS, DO NOT USE THE SOFTWARE AND PROMPTLY RETURN THE DISC OR CARTRIDGE IN ITS ORIGINAL PACKAGING TO THE PLACE OF PURCHASE.
1. Grant of License. The software accompanying this iicense and reiated documentation (the "Software") is iicensed to you, not soid, by Infogrames, inc. ("infogrames"), and its use is subject to this iicense. infogrames grants to you a iimited, personai, non-exciusive right to use the Software in the manner described in the user documentation. If the Software is configured for loading onto a hard drive, you may load the Software only onto the hard drive of a single machine and run the Software from only that hard drive. You may permanently transfer all rights Infogrames grants to you in this license, provided you retain no copies, you transfer all of the Software (including all component parts, the media and printed materials, and any upgrades), and the recipient reads and accepts this license. Infogrames reserves all rights not expressly granted to you by this Agreement.
2. Restrictions, infogrames or its suppliers own the title, copyright, and other intellectual property rights in the Software. The Software contains copyrighted material, trade secrets and other proprietary material. You may not delete the copyright notices or any other proprietary legends on the original copy of the Software. You may not decompile, modify, reverse engineer, disassemble or otherwise reproduce the Software. You may not copy, rent, lease, sublicense or distribute the Software. You may not electronically transmit the Software from one computer, console or other platform to another or over a network. Any attempt to transfer any of the rights, duties or obligations hereunder is void,
3. Termination. This License is effective until terminated. You may terminate this License at any time by destroying the Software. This License will terminate immediately without notice from Infogrames if you fail to comply with any provision of this license. Upon termination, you must destroy the Software. 4. Disclaimer of Warranty on Software. You are aware and agree that use of the Software and the media on which it is recorded is at your sole risk. The Software and the mediaare provided "AS IS.' Unless otherwise provided by applicable law, Infogrames warrants to the original purchaser of this product that the Software storage medium will be free from defects of materials and workmanship for ninety (90) days from the date of purchase. This warranty is void it the defect has arisen through accident, abuse, neglect or misapplication. INFOGRAMES EXPRESSLY DISCLAIMS ALL OTHER WARRANTIES, EXPRESS OR IMPLIED, INCLUDING, BUT NOT LIMITED TO, THE IMPLIED WARRANTIES OF MERCHANTABILITY AND FITNESS FOR A PARTICULAR PURPOSE. INFOGRAMES DOES NOT WARRANT THAT THE FUNCTIONS CONTAINED IN THE SOFTWARE WILL MEET YOUR REQUIREMENTS. NO ORAL OR WRITTEN INFORMATION OR ADVICE GIVEN BY INFOGRAMES OR ANY INFOGRAMES-AUTHORIZED REPRESENTATIVE SHALL
CREATE A WARRANTY OR IN ANY WAY INCREASE THE SCOPE OF THIS WARRANTY. SOME JURISOICTIONS DO NOT ALLOW THE EXCLUSION OF IMPLIED WARRANTIES, SO THE ABOVE EXCLUSIONS MAY NOT APPLY TO YOU. 5. Limitation of Liability, UNDER NO CIRCUMSTANCES, INCLUDING NEGLIGENCE.SHALL INFOGRAMES BE LIABLE FOR ANY INCIDENTAL, SPECIAL OR CONSEQUENTIAL DAMAGES IN CONNECTION WITH THE SOFTWARE, INCLUDING THOSE THAT RESULT FROM THE USE OF OR INABILITY TO USE THE SOFTWARE, EVEN IF INFOGRAMES HAS BEEN ADVISED OF THE POSSIBILITY OF THOSE DAMAGES. IN NO EVENT SHALL INFOGRAME’S TOTAL LIABILITY TO YOU FOR ALL DAMAGES, LOSSES AND CAUSES OF ACTION (WHETHER IN CONTRACT, TORT OR OTHERWISE) EXCEED THE AMOUNT PAID BY YOU FOR THE SOFTWARE. SOME JURIS- DICTIONS DO NOT ALLOW THE LIMITATION OR EXCLUSION OF LIABILITY FOR INCIDENTAL OR CONSEQUENTIAL DAMAGES, SO THE ABOVE LIMITATION OR EXCLUSION MAY NOT APPLY TO YOU.
6. Miscellaneous. This license shall be governed by and construed in accordance with the laws of the State of New York, USA, exclu- sive of its choice of law and/or contliots of law jurisprudence; and, in respect of any dispute which may arise hereunder, you consent to the jurisdiction of the federal and state courts of New York County, New York. If any provision of this license is unenforceable, the rest of it shall remain in effect. This license (including any addendum or amendment to this license which is included with the Software) constitutes the entire agreement between you and Infogrames with respect to the use of the Software and the support services (if any) and they supersede all prior or contemporaneous oral or written communications and representations with respect to the Software or any other subject matter covered by this license.
Did the dreamcast version include Unreal Editor and ucc.exe? If not, this license cannot be applied unless you use such platform to build your maps and mods?I haven't read the Dreamcast EULA as I don't own the Dreamcast game. If you use PC, you are under PC EULA, Dreamcast (and Unreal) has nothing to do with what EG asked about initialy? You can't puchase a product for one platform and then perform edits on another platform and just switch between what is best from both versions, law doesn't work that way.
EvilGrins wrote: Fri Jun 19, 2020 1:58 pm
TheDane wrote: Thu Jun 18, 2020 9:00 pmCreditting is not sufficient according to the Unreal Engine EULA
I suppose I could also throw each mapper a parade, but that seems a bit much.
Ha ha, yeah, but they'll love it? 8) No, look at the history of the game, I have no knowledge of any kind of trials/disputes over user created content in the past, do you? All I'm saying, is that I honestly belive we are covered by the updated EULA, it's like taking a drivers license, once completed you yourself are obligated by low to follow up on any traffic rule changes made - when they are made, and act in trafic accordingly. The same goes with EULA's, they (EPIC) can change it on-the-fly, and as long as they post it public, we are obligated to update on it and act accordingly. So, in short, a developer owns whe he/she creates on his/her own and we MUST ask permission to use/edit it. But come on, lots of my crap maps and mods have been edited, to infinity and back, and I don't mind at all. But law is law, and it's tricky to find out exactly how it works, that's why the is so many lawyers in the world :loool:
Retired.
User avatar
OjitroC
Godlike
Posts: 3605
Joined: Sat Sep 12, 2015 8:46 pm

Re: Crediting others for their work is important...

Post by OjitroC »

TheDane wrote: Fri Jun 19, 2020 3:34 pm All I'm saying, is that I honestly belive we are covered by the updated EULA, it's like taking a drivers license, once completed you yourself are obligated by low to follow up on any traffic rule changes made - when they are made, and act in trafic accordingly. The same goes with EULA's, they (EPIC) can change it on-the-fly, and as long as they post it public, we are obligated to update on it and act accordingly. So, in short, a developer owns whe he/she creates on his/her own and we MUST ask permission to use/edit it.
I agree with your last sentence - however I don't agree that Epic can change the terms of a 20 year old EULA - to do that, the original EULA (covering UT99 for example) would need to say that it would be subject to subsequent amendment and none of the ones I've seen do that. In fact they make it clear that that those EULAs are sole Agreement between the user of the software and Epic. Again, we come back to the practical point that if we are now bound by the current EULA how do we decide what applies to us when, for example, we can't download the Engine Source code for UT99 (and there are many other provisions, definitions, etc in the EULA that don't apply to UT99)? As I said an Agreement which leaves it up to the individual to decide what applies to them is an unsound agreement. Lastly, surely, if the current EULA applies to all users of all iterations of the Unreal Engine, then the current EULA should make that unambiguoulsy clear - this isn't stated anywhere in the current EULA and so it would be reasonable to conclude on that basis that it doesn't apply to anything other than the current iteration of the Unreal Engine.

I posted the Unreal and the Dreamcast EULAs merely as a matter of interest - the former indicates what an Epic EULA covering a game with an editor looks like and the latter shows an EULA for a version of UT99 without an editor. As I stated, the Dreamcast EULAs is similar in most respects to the EULA I've seen for UT99 GOTYE. I'm not suggesting that anyone other than users of the respective software are bound by those EULAs.
Red_Fist
Godlike
Posts: 2163
Joined: Sun Oct 05, 2008 3:31 am

Re: Crediting others for their work is important...

Post by Red_Fist »

I have hotmail, all they did was change the interface from being just emails to all the other things added, they said you can keep the hotmail name, but everything in it is all "outlook"

They changed the name and added stuff, and offered to turn ads off if you pay.

I don't like the way it changed at all.
Binary Space Partitioning
User avatar
sektor2111
Godlike
Posts: 6403
Joined: Sun May 09, 2010 6:15 pm
Location: On the roof.

Re: Crediting others for their work is important...

Post by sektor2111 »

Did you know what Kelly told me when it was about those MH junks (called often maps) ? He said about a bunch of e-mails sent without any reply. Some of those mappers were only making files testing Editor and throwing them in the wild - lab failures more exactly. Do you need some name ? I have an "entertaining" one, a map which keeps any server empty as long as it doesn't have PlayerStart actors, if admin won't setup "EmptyServerSwitchTime" or such in whatever Map-Vote is using. Write an e-mail to author of "WeirdOrWonderful" junk - said MH map, and let me know how goes with credits and the rest of SPAM debates - Ask him what is the purpose of such file released in the wild. Server-Damage, that's the right term.
Others are not critical or a hazard file for a server but definitely they are more or less bugged or incomplete or using poorly coded packages even if are good looking ones - pretty disappointing. Good luck with e-mails and permissions... Talking about these it's a waste of time for real - these are jokes and experiments...

Note: I'm not sure if I want to send e-mails at people which I don't know them well... as result, I'm not even responding at not exactly requested "e-mails".

Next: Aside, writing credits sounds fine to me. Author is a variable self-explanatory in LevelInfo - perhaps my name as editor-guy has no deal there because I'm not the Author - logic, I'm an editor. Whoever don't like an edited version, has the freedom to use ORIGINAL file.
Keep in mind that I did my bad stuff because I did not have all toys which I'm having now (and it's place for more) and... if anyone wants to setup a party in my junks I do not have anything against editing. I'll play edited versions if are better than mine... I did not even signed my last MH map because I really don't care if anyone will edit it or not (definitely messing up paths - lol), ripped from Cache because I loaded it in a server and doing nothing as a download link - a waste of time for writing "sektor's gibberish TXT walls".
User avatar
OjitroC
Godlike
Posts: 3605
Joined: Sat Sep 12, 2015 8:46 pm

Re: Crediting others for their work is important...

Post by OjitroC »

As a matter of interest, the EULA for the GOTY edition of UT99 can be found here https://wiki.beyondunreal.com/Unreal_To ... _agreement.

The following makes it clear how the Agreement can be altered "This Agreement represents the complete agreement concerning the licence granted hereunder and may be amended only by a writing executed by both parties." The "licence hereunder" refers to the licence to use the software (in accordance with the terms in the rest of the EULA). This should clear up any doubt that the EULA for the current Unreal Engine covers UT99 as well, given that there has been "no writing executed by both parties" (being Epic and each individual owning a copy of UT99) and so the UT99 GOTY EULA has not been amended or superceded by a later EULA and it remains the only Agreement covering the use, etc of UT99.

This bit deals with content - "Title, ownership rights, and intellectual property rights in the Software shall remain with the Licensor. The Software is protected by copyright and other intellectual property laws and by international treaties. Title and related rights in the content accessed through the Softw are is the property of the applicable content owner and is protected by applicable law. The license granted under this Agreement gives you no rights to such content." Content accessed through the Software would include community made assets, as well as those assets made to be used in the software by firms other than Epic (and any other company who might have been Licensor). So it is clear that title and related rights remain with the makers of content. This again clears up the misunderstanding that Epic (or indeed anyone other than the person(s) creating the content) has proprietory or other rights over user-created content.

Attention has been drawn in the past to various other provisions of an EULA but it seems to me that people have been quoting from an EULA for UT3 in particular - this, of course, has no bearing on the rights parties have under the EULA for UT99 GOTY.

I have no idea whether there are EULAs for other versions of UT99 and whether they might contain different provisions.

It does seem odd to me that Epic didn't include the provisions relating to the use of, and rights over content created, in/by the Editor from the Unreal EULA but nothing like that appears in the UT99 GOTY EULA.
Red_Fist
Godlike
Posts: 2163
Joined: Sun Oct 05, 2008 3:31 am

Re: Crediting others for their work is important...

Post by Red_Fist »

sektor2111 wrote: Fri Jun 19, 2020 6:21 pm Did you know what Kelly told me when it was about those MH junks (called often maps) ? He said about a bunch of e-mails sent without any reply. Some of those mappers were only making files testing Editor and throwing them in the wild - lab failures more exactly. Do you need some name ? I have an "entertaining" one, a map which keeps any server empty as long as it doesn't have PlayerStart actors, if admin won't setup "EmptyServerSwitchTime" or such in whatever Map-Vote is using. Write an e-mail to author of "WeirdOrWonderful" junk - said MH map, and let me know how goes with credits and the rest of SPAM debates - Ask him what is the purpose of such file released in the wild. Server-Damage, that's the right term.
Others are not critical or a hazard file for a server but definitely they are more or less bugged or incomplete or using poorly coded packages even if are good looking ones - pretty disappointing. Good luck with e-mails and permissions... Talking about these it's a waste of time for real - these are jokes and experiments...

Note: I'm not sure if I want to send e-mails at people which I don't know them well... as result, I'm not even responding at not exactly requested "e-mails".

Next: Aside, writing credits sounds fine to me. Author is a variable self-explanatory in LevelInfo - perhaps my name as editor-guy has no deal there because I'm not the Author - logic, I'm an editor. Whoever don't like an edited version, has the freedom to use ORIGINAL file.
Keep in mind that I did my bad stuff because I did not have all toys which I'm having now (and it's place for more) and... if anyone wants to setup a party in my junks I do not have anything against editing. I'll play edited versions if are better than mine... I did not even signed my last MH map because I really don't care if anyone will edit it or not (definitely messing up paths - lol), ripped from Cache because I loaded it in a server and doing nothing as a download link - a waste of time for writing "sektor's gibberish TXT walls".

I consider the "server dude" as the god of getting my maps played, as opposed to some starch stupid ass "rules" that has no consequence from an author who died or got a life making real money, LoL

They should be very satisfied we break the law all day everyday for their maps. :loool:
Binary Space Partitioning
User avatar
TheDane
Masterful
Posts: 660
Joined: Tue Feb 12, 2008 2:47 pm
Personal rank: Happy fool :-)

Re: Crediting others for their work is important...

Post by TheDane »

OjitroC wrote: Fri Jun 19, 2020 11:23 pm As a matter of interest, the EULA for the GOTY edition of UT99 can be found here https://wiki.beyondunreal.com/Unreal_To ... _agreement.

The following makes it clear how the Agreement can be altered "This Agreement represents the complete agreement concerning the licence granted hereunder and may be amended only by a writing executed by both parties." The "licence hereunder" refers to the licence to use the software (in accordance with the terms in the rest of the EULA). This should clear up any doubt that the EULA for the current Unreal Engine covers UT99 as well, given that there has been "no writing executed by both parties" (being Epic and each individual owning a copy of UT99) and so the UT99 GOTY EULA has not been amended or superceded by a later EULA and it remains the only Agreement covering the use, etc of UT99.

This bit deals with content - "Title, ownership rights, and intellectual property rights in the Software shall remain with the Licensor. The Software is protected by copyright and other intellectual property laws and by international treaties. Title and related rights in the content accessed through the Softw are is the property of the applicable content owner and is protected by applicable law. The license granted under this Agreement gives you no rights to such content." Content accessed through the Software would include community made assets, as well as those assets made to be used in the software by firms other than Epic (and any other company who might have been Licensor). So it is clear that title and related rights remain with the makers of content. This again clears up the misunderstanding that Epic (or indeed anyone other than the person(s) creating the content) has proprietory or other rights over user-created content.

Attention has been drawn in the past to various other provisions of an EULA but it seems to me that people have been quoting from an EULA for UT3 in particular - this, of course, has no bearing on the rights parties have under the EULA for UT99 GOTY.

I have no idea whether there are EULAs for other versions of UT99 and whether they might contain different provisions.

It does seem odd to me that Epic didn't include the provisions relating to the use of, and rights over content created, in/by the Editor from the Unreal EULA but nothing like that appears in the UT99 GOTY EULA.
That EULA is user created (Wormbo) and NOT official. It was due to a prior post I made on this board: viewtopic.php?t=5725

So, this link makes nothing clear at all, it's NOT EPIC official content, it's copy/paste from outdated content derived from one particular product purchased by Wormbo.

Now, this may be a hot topic, as I think EPIC is watching this. two days ago the link to the topic I raised at their forums (from my link above dated back to 2014) worked, but I just clicked it, and it seems it has disappeared from their forums? What a strange coinsident? Why?
Retired.
User avatar
OjitroC
Godlike
Posts: 3605
Joined: Sat Sep 12, 2015 8:46 pm

Re: Crediting others for their work is important...

Post by OjitroC »

TheDane wrote: Sat Jun 20, 2020 6:20 am That EULA is user created (Wormbo) and NOT official. It was due to a prior post I made on this board: viewtopic.php?t=5725

So, this link makes nothing clear at all, it's NOT EPIC official content, it's copy/paste from outdated content derived from one particular product purchased by Wormbo.
Sorry I'm lost here - if that EULA is copied from the manual accompanying that version of UT99, then it is official, it is a textual representation of what's in the manual in exactly the same way as my earlier posting of the text from the Dreamcast version of the game is. How can it not be official? It is a text copy of the EULA - Wormbo could have posted a .jpg of it and so could I but Wormbo and I chose to post text and that doesn't make it any less official.

How can the content be outdated? Outdated in what sense? My copy of UT99 GOTY dates from around then, that doesn't make it outdated - it's what I'm still using (just as I'm sure lots of people are still using copies of the game from that time) and so my rights to the software are governed by any EULA that applied to that software at the time of purchase and came with my copy of the game.

Interestingly, the EULAs posted so far are all drawn from the manuals accompanying the game - there is no EULA in my copy of the manual for UT99 GOTYE but merely a warranty from Midway Home Entertainment (presumably the distributors) and credits for Epic, Digital Extremes and Infogames.

It is quite possible that there was no EULA for my version and it is quite possible that different versions of UT99 are covered by different EULAs, though it is unlikely that they would be radically different. There is, for example, a slightly different EULA for the GOG version of UT99 GOTYE (included as a separate text file with the game download) and the manual for that version of the game is the same as that for other versions and so does not contain an EULA from Epic.

At the risk of dragging this on too long - this is an extract from the UT2003 EULA in the manual for that game - one crucial point to note is that under 9, Epic and Infogames reserve the right to modify the EULA - this is crucial because this is NOT done in the three EULAs posted thus far in this thread. So, whilst for UT2003 the EULA in the manual does not necessarily represent the complete Agreement between Epic and the user, for the users covered by the three EULA posted here the EULA in the respective manuals DOES represent the complete agreement and those Agreements are NOT subject to later change.
Spoiler
UT2003.jpg
Last edited by OjitroC on Sat Jun 20, 2020 12:05 pm, edited 1 time in total.
User avatar
TheDane
Masterful
Posts: 660
Joined: Tue Feb 12, 2008 2:47 pm
Personal rank: Happy fool :-)

Re: Crediting others for their work is important...

Post by TheDane »

OjitroC wrote: Sat Jun 20, 2020 10:59 am Sorry I'm lost here - if that EULA is copied from the manual accompanying that version of UT99, then it is official, it is a textual representation of what's in the manual in exactly the same way as my earlier posting of the text from the Dreamcast version of the game is. How can it not be official? It is a text copy of the EULA - Wormbo could have posted a .jpg of it and so could I but Wormbo and I chose to post text and that doesn't make it any less official.
Actualy you put in escense what makes it invalid. If you or Wormbo copies text to a third party website, that makes it unofficial. Why is that hard to understand? Official means it's posted by the OWNER, not users, who can (not saying they do) alter all they want in the process? The license is an agrrement between the OWNER and the one who PURCHASED the game, it cannot be pasted onto others, even if they have the same game, if others purchase the game, it's the EULA that comes with the EXACT copy of the game they purchase that is counting (unless it ofcause has been updated). People using warez have no right to play nor edit the game, so using a pirate software and just think the EULA can protect them from people not using theie "copyrighted" mods, are foolish to think so. So, in short, you also have to prove you own a legit copy of the game INCLUDING editor and ucc.exe to be able to claim ownership on anything you make.
OjitroC wrote: Sat Jun 20, 2020 10:59 am How can the content be outdated? Outdated in what sense?
Ehmm... you don't remember we speak about a new updated EULA that according to the OWNER of the Unreal Engine dates back to 1998 - rendering prior releases outdated? A license works until it gets changed/updated, from therof it's outdated and replaced by the new version. So if your EULA is not outdated according to you, then it's because you don't accept that it has been replaced with a newer version.
Retired.
User avatar
OjitroC
Godlike
Posts: 3605
Joined: Sat Sep 12, 2015 8:46 pm

Re: Crediting others for their work is important...

Post by OjitroC »

I edited my previous post whilst you were posting your reply so you may wish to have another look at it.
TheDane wrote: Sat Jun 20, 2020 12:01 pm If you or Wormbo copies text to a third party website, that makes it unofficial. Why is that hard to understand? Official means it's posted by the OWNER, not user,
It's hard to understand because it isn't the case. The EULA that I posted for Unreal is a textual represetation of the EULA in the Unreal Manual - it is a representation of the agreement I have with Epic over the use of the Unreal software - posting it in text doesn't make it unofficial. As I say I could have posted a .jpg but chose text instead.
TheDane wrote: Sat Jun 20, 2020 12:01 pm Ehmm... you don't remember we speak about a new updated EULA that according to the OWNER of the Unreal Engine dates back to 1998 - rendering prior releases outdated? A license works until it gets changed/updated, from therof it's outdated and replaced by the new version. So if your EULA is not outdated according to you, then it's because you don't accept that it has been replaced with a newer version.
No, sorry - that's not correct. The licence works in accordance with the terms it contains - you'll note that the ones I've posted indicate that the EULA is the COMPLETE agreement (one indicates it can only be altered in writing by BOTH parties - the lisensor and the user). Unless the EULA reserves the right for later alteration (as the UT2003 EULA does), it represents the complete and only agreement between the lisensor and purchaser/user) for the use of the software which is the subject of the licence. It is not possible to alter an Agreement unless that Agreement contains provisions for alteration - that is a clear legal position.

The EULA for the current iteration of the Unreal Engine relates solely to the use of that Engine Code - it does not relate to the use of earlier versions - nowhere in that EULA does it say it relates to previous versions. It is clear it can not relate to previous versions because, at the very least, ordinary users do not have access to the code of previous versions of the Engine Code. WIth UT99, the game and editor use the code of the engine, the user does not - the user uses the game and the editor. There is a significant difference here.
User avatar
TheDane
Masterful
Posts: 660
Joined: Tue Feb 12, 2008 2:47 pm
Personal rank: Happy fool :-)

Re: Crediting others for their work is important...

Post by TheDane »

OjitroC wrote: Sat Jun 20, 2020 12:39 pm (one indicates it can only be altered in writing by BOTH parties - the lisensor and the user)
I see that obsolutely nowhere in my EULA nor the only one public available. Please provide me with a valid link to such written sentence writen and posted by an official source? That would be great, then we would know we are under the old agreement if it's online at an official place, otherwise we are down to the agreement in our OWN purchase, not any EULA posted by others through their purchases. Your egreement is yours alone, it does not affect me or others?

Please stop this yes-no-yes-no-yes-no, don't copy/paste stuff, give me a link to the official EULA where it states that an agreement cannot be altered? Many (if not all?) companies does this, e.g. PayPal has updated thier agreement 3 times alone this year. It's very common to adjust agreements to fit "today". UT EULA as you post reflects the status 20 years ago - EPIC is entitled (according to my personal EULA) to do so?
Retired.
darksonny
Adept
Posts: 452
Joined: Sat Sep 13, 2008 10:24 pm

Re: Crediting others for their work is important...

Post by darksonny »

Is here any dead mapper in current times? I dont know of any as im aware of
Post Reply