Max amount of movers?

[Isotoxin]

Hey,

I'm asking the exact amount of the movers ued can handle, if it has a maximum ofcourse, Since I got some trouble in ued.

see ss.. :

[Shadow]

How does the issue express in detail? Theoretically the mover count is limited by the node limit.

[Isotoxin]

How does the issue express in detail? Theoretically the mover count is limited by the node limit.

Hmh i see, So, it's not like, for example ued can handle 200movers, if you go over the limit they'll be bugged and stuff?

There are no problems yet, Anyway, I'm trying to avoid em .

[Shadow]

No limit I've had heard off yet

Just keep on mapping

[Feralidragon]

Actually I have read somewhere that there was an actual vertex count limit for movers, and if you passed that "limit", polys would start to randomly disappear, even if you made the whole thing "right" (relative actors order and etc).

I don't quite remember where I saw it (I think it was in unrealsp.org, idk) and the veracity of the info, but if you can avoid movers (specially many in the same place/view), better do it, or weird things may indeed happen.

[FraGnBraG]

feral that's good advice like all things in ue/ued, there is a limit - i have that info *somewhere* but i assure you u will get no where near the mover count limit before your map explodes

about mover / brush issues, you can have two simple lifts in one map and they can be totally f**kd up - depends how you made them, the complexity of the bsp in the area around them, whether they touch anything else, how you use them (exampl attcahment schemes, "mover ballet" etc etc etc...

i have some amazing examples all that is bad with movers (not just in my map adventures - most recently a great a$$ giant cargo lift in the W.I.P. Olympia Chronicles SP project - i had to iterate down the design detail like three times until I got it stable and working - big pain...

With regard to the builder brush itself you use to add the mover the K.I.S.S. principle works best whenever you have a LOT of movers, but if there's only a few then they can be more complex. Also, when you block out your map, add the movers (or prototypes/placeholder movers) as early as possible in the process - this lets you know as you add details if you'll have problems (i.e. don't wait till the end of BSP work to convert static bsp into movers - otherwise you can find yourself making a lot of bsp changes which can mess things up in other parts of your map that are already finished....

With regards to csg brushes in general, something like 500 polys per builder brush was a common limit (that info was from an epic mapper in the unreal days - i can't remember who, maybe it was inoxx - but i tried intersecting a 500 poly brush once just to see and it was pretty funny (full of holes) but it built.

On the other hand, there was this custom version of thorns once where the bugger just intersected the entire map - curious about how many polys/nodes on that big subtract and whether there's any holes ... ? it is possible that brush had less than 500 (thorns is pretty simple geometry, after all) maybe i'll check...

Anyways, sorry for wind-bagging, hope this helps

[robin13]

yea there's a limit. i found this out by suprise actualy.

i once made a map with a destructable wall. (each brick = 1 mover) so yea that was a lot of movers next/above/under eachother.

each brick was about 16x16x32. wall was 16x1024x256 so that was a total of 512 indivudual movers in a small space. well, lets just say that didnt end up exactly as i hoped to achiev. (lots of bsp errors/holes)

[Feralidragon]

well, lets just say that didnt end up exactly as i hoped to achiev. (lots of bsp errors/holes)

You mean the actual movers, right? Because I know one thing for certain: movers do not affect the BSP tree, so the only "holes" and occlusion bugs they can cause are on themselves only.

[GenMoKai]

There was a number... but i really cant remember... i knew that XYZ should know that... he told me once, but he isnt that active anymore in the UT99 game

[Creavion]

There was a number...

At first I was like

but i really cant remember...

but then I wasl like

I do not know either. I do not think its a matter of amount or complexity but rather how close they stand to each other and BT is a mover heavy gametype. But since movers are brushes as well its also of course possible that bsp bugs show themself prefered on movers. Its really requiered to get a replacement of brush movers (soon).

[Isotoxin]

There was a number...

At first I was like

but i really cant remember...

but then I wasl like

I do not know either. I do not think its a matter of amount or complexity but rather how close they stand to each other and BT is a mover heavy gametype. But since movers are brushes as well its also of course possible that bsp bugs show themself prefered on movers. Its really requiered to get a replacement of brush movers (soon).

I'll hold that in mind, Thanks.

[Ozma777]

there is a max node count I found it when making BT-Krall-Fortress (Some of the movers still look horrible but it was a choice of nice looking movers that are not really seen and broken map or crap looking movers in some spots and releasing the map).

Anyway....
I asked on i4games and they said it was about 65000. Problem is....UT does NOT count nodes for movers. So what you have to do to see if you have gone over the limit is right click a mover say select all normal movers (and all other movers too) and say show polys on all of them. This might take up to 5 minutes if you have lots of complex movers meanwhile Ued is locked up so just wait. Then after you have showed polys go into the build options and find where it shows the stats and hit "refresh". Now you will know if you have gone over. But also too much complexity in one space confuses Ued too. Sometimes if you just move things one unit away everything is fine. Like just move the jump blocks in the water all 1 unit off the floor so they do not touch. Or move the dodgeblock 1 unit away from the mover so they do not touch. Movers touching movers is sometimes bad too. Non-solids or semi-solids touching things also sometimes are bad.
AND what is strange is sometimes fixing these things listed above miraculously let the movers in that room be normal again with no change to the mover at all. Also if all the movers on one side (in ctf or bt) are fine you can sometimes just delete the bad ones and duplicate the ones from the good side. And you can always try remaking the mover after the room has been built without it.