Making Unreal/UT Music

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Terraniux
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Making Unreal/UT Music

Post by Terraniux » Tue Feb 21, 2017 9:27 pm

This idea of making U / UT music has been stored for a long time in my head.

I've given several attempts to make it, but I never can get to the ''main part of the song''

A rock music sample :

gentlebass guiter >>>> drum > More drum + base >>>> Drum + Base + hi hats etc >> then a riffline of a quitar.

Hardstyle / Hardcore >>>> A voice or melody > bass starts with 150/160 bpm .... duududmdum boom, dudmdumdm boom.... etc.


As in the game UT I do hear and recoginze a pattern : deep slow brass / bass, a a windup /lifty sound . and then boomtsssjjjjj and so on.

But Unreal ? UT ? . Where do I start ?

what is a good pattern?

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Re: Making Unreal/UT Music

Post by papercoffee » Tue Feb 21, 2017 9:36 pm

I'm a little bit puzzled. What exactly is your ...question?

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Re: Making Unreal/UT Music

Post by Terraniux » Tue Feb 21, 2017 10:03 pm

papercoffee wrote:I'm a little bit puzzled. What exactly is your ...question?

Every music has some sort of ''pattern'''of instruments. I'm looking for some instruments that make a you feel like you are in the Unreal / UT environment.
Like the stock music packages that comes with the games. They are awesome.

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Re: Making Unreal/UT Music

Post by smeerkat » Wed Feb 22, 2017 1:02 am

I bet if you reached out to Alexander Brandon, he would be happy to give you some tips.

https://alexanderbrandon.bandcamp.com/

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Carbon
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Re: Making Unreal/UT Music

Post by Carbon » Wed Feb 22, 2017 2:07 am

There is no paint-by-numbers approach to composition but as with most forms of communication, there is a general form to a work: Introduction, exposition, build up (tension), peak or climax, denouement (release), conclusion. This of course is a terrible over-generalization, but it is roughly accurate.

How this is achieved is up to you; with what instruments, melodies, rhythms, etc; this is the art, something nobody can teach you.

I suggest that you make some notes while listening and I think you will find a loose trend within the structures of the songs. Note this and follow accordingly.

Tough question really, but just sit down and play with ideas...you might find that things begin to take shape.

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Re: Making Unreal/UT Music

Post by papercoffee » Wed Feb 22, 2017 2:35 am

The UT music is mostly created with a tracker program ... find OpenMPT install it and then you can open umx files with it and look into it's structure.
The used instruments? I would say many synthesiser sounds combined with industrial percussions and metal guitars mixed together with a mod-file sound library.

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Re: Making Unreal/UT Music

Post by SilverSound » Wed Feb 22, 2017 9:03 pm

When it comes to music it can be hard if you don't have the creative mind for it.

Like what paper said. Open up the UMX files in OpenMPT and save all the sound files for the instruments. That's what alex and the others used in all of the songs. You'll see and hear some of the same sounds used creatively to make it sound new.


Tracker music can be tough though. Not easy.

Just practice for a while and you'll get the hang of it.

Also a midi keyboard would go a LONG way and getting you started.
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Re: Making Unreal/UT Music

Post by Terraniux » Wed Feb 22, 2017 10:35 pm

Allright. I do have MPT tracker and the player. I use them for mp3>UMX conversion.

I can make sounds, I can make several kinds of genres with different programs, yet UT has this 'spark, so unique and warm feeling. :D


You guys know what I'm talking about. :highfive:
Every map I make is made from zero, I want the same for music. I just want some inspiration instruments.


Ahh..... I see.


Question:
But isn't opening and use the same instruments the music 'stealing' ? Opening other maps, and discover them inside, and learn from them is totally ok.

But does that count the same for music? I'm just checking. :roll:

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Carbon
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Re: Making Unreal/UT Music

Post by Carbon » Thu Feb 23, 2017 12:11 am

Stealing is stealing...looking is looking. :)

If "using the same instruments" means copying from the source then I think you will have to look at copyright on music; I believe the limit is 4 bars and past that, it's not cool (without permission).

Using the same instruments or sounds....not sure, but I would think that would be fine. Not sure about that though.

I see a process of trial and error in your future mate, but you will prevail!

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SilverSound
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Re: Making Unreal/UT Music

Post by SilverSound » Thu Feb 23, 2017 3:16 am

Terraniux wrote: Question:
But isn't opening and use the same instruments the music 'stealing' ? Opening other maps, and discover them inside, and learn from them is totally ok.

But does that count the same for music? I'm just checking. :roll:
No! Definitely not! Back in the 90s when tracker music was the thing, Everyone used sounds and snidbits from other tracker files! It happens a lot. Trust me it's perfectly fine to use the sounds used in the songs.

Alex himself said this I think. He also mentioned that some of the sounds were just recordings of a korg synthesizer.


TlDr: Perfectly normal!
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Re: Making Unreal/UT Music

Post by Terraniux » Thu Feb 23, 2017 6:33 pm



This is exactly what I like to recreate - amazing stuff. :)

---
Stealing is stealing...looking is looking. :)

If "using the same instruments" means copying from the source then I think you will have to look at copyright on music; I believe the limit is 4 bars and past that, it's not cool (without permission).

Using the same instruments or sounds....not sure, but I would think that would be fine. Not sure about that though.

I see a process of trial and error in your future mate, but you will prevail!
yeah, that is exactly why I ask the questions - just in case. I don't want to steal anything, just a tiny kickstart with instruments to play with.
Yes we will prevail.

SilverSound wrote:
Terraniux wrote: Question:
But isn't opening and use the same instruments the music 'stealing' ? Opening other maps, and discover them inside, and learn from them is totally ok.

But does that count the same for music? I'm just checking. :roll:
No! Definitely not! Back in the 90s when tracker music was the thing, Everyone used sounds and snidbits from other tracker files! It happens a lot. Trust me it's perfectly fine to use the sounds used in the songs.

Alex himself said this I think. He also mentioned that some of the sounds were just recordings of a korg synthesizer.


TlDr: Perfectly normal!

Allright. Thanks for the information. I'll see what I can use.

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Re: Making Unreal/UT Music

Post by papercoffee » Thu Feb 23, 2017 6:45 pm

UMX is UT content ...if used in UT, I don't see where this harms the End User License Agreement.
If you plan to use it in another game or in a commercial way and claim it as your own product... that's another story. This would be an EULA infringement.

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Re: Making Unreal/UT Music

Post by Zanna » Thu Feb 23, 2017 9:13 pm

papercoffee wrote:If you plan to use it in another game or in a commercial way and claim it as your own product... that's another story. This would be an EULA infringement.
not quite. the sounds inside an .umx are not property of epic. the songs are though
some of the sounds actually are because they were recorded by the guys working on the ost themselves though, so always check the infos on them
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Re: Making Unreal/UT Music

Post by papercoffee » Thu Feb 23, 2017 10:21 pm

Zanna wrote:the sounds inside an .umx are not property of epic.
Well, but licensed by a third party for Epic.
As an company can't you use stuff from others for commercial use without getting the license for it.

For example: The free Windows Fonts are only free for non commercial use and licensed for the End User. If another company tries to use those "free" fonts on their product which they use to generate income, is the possibility very high that they'll get a letter from a lawyer.
A small company can get away with it, without Microsoft even care about it (too much of a hassle), but a big company like Epic won't get away that easily.

I experienced this when I tried to make Corporate Logos for the fictive companies in UT for the new UT4. I got warned by several colleagues, that those fonts I had used must be royalty-free or self created or Epic will face some license infringements.
This means they won't use any of my creations.

Tl;dr
Without a license would Epic never use any stuff in their products. Therefore using it in UT wouldn't go against the EULA. Taking something out of UT and use it in your own products would be a license infringement against the licensee and third party copyright holder.

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Re: Making Unreal/UT Music

Post by SilverSound » Fri Feb 24, 2017 8:47 pm

papercoffee wrote:
Tl;dr
Without a license would Epic never use any stuff in their products. Therefore using it in UT wouldn't go against the EULA. Taking something out of UT and use it in your own products would be a license infringement against the licensee and third party copyright holder.
If you use the sounds from a music file on UT for your own product you won't be in trouble. There was a website dedicated to wav files for songs. Everyone and their mother used these and some from other peoples projects.

It was a common thing. It wasn't frowned upon. So applying general EULA and copyright logic doesn't work for this music currently.

Only when you take riffs and notes from the song do you get in trouble. No one likes a copycat.
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