:\ PC Reboot Issues

[Feralidragon]

A problem with my pc:

The problem is: my PC never ever hangs, and it NEVER reboots under light or heavy normal 3D games, from UT99 to FIFA07 and even UT2004 with 1024x768 resolution (32bit color) and everything tunned to max quality, and it doesn't even stutters with this GT.

It only reboots: in certain websites (using FireFox), like hi5, gamespot, devianart, photobucket most times and filefront some times, but it never reboots in wings forums, beyondunreal or other normal forums, and some isolated events in another program (that now with the chipset update I apllied now seems to run fine).
And I have already cleaned cache, and it auto deletes any cookies at app closing.

Still, no BSODs, no error or warning events in the log (be it either in applications, security and even system), so I don't really what is happening.

Also I can't open the case since it's still in warranty until the end of this month, so I can't really evaluate anything from it, mostly if there are bad caps or not (but still, even with bad caps, the software and moments are too exact to be the mobo).

And what I mean about BIOS messed after sudden shutdown or normal shutdown from power when the PC is already off, is that sometimes it looses all the settings (including time), other times it just modifies some settings by itself, making me loading the default settings and then adjust the boot order and CPU settings again.

So it's hardly the PSU (since this one is a new one) and since the PC strangelly never complains when running some heavier programs and games, even if for hours.
RAM is ok, CPU is ok i guess, the GCard is new and it didn't even passed from 70ºC in UT2004 in a 28ºC environment (even cooler than my old active cooling one, since this is passive/silent).
HDs are fine, since no error was ever given and I already made a 12Gb transfer from a disk to the other, during 40 min or more, and it didn't even made any noise.
All temperatures are fine, also all the clocks (except the CPU one, which is a bit overclocked [+2/7MHz] and which is like that since I bought my PC 2 years ago).

But still yesterday I searched further about this issue, and I found that an outdated bios can give some issues. My bios version is 0901 and the most recent and stable one is the 0904 (there's even a more recent one, but it's still in beta), and the updating of the bios solved some weird reboot problems to some people. And now that I think about that, I never had reboot problems with the GS, which had a 64bit memory interface and Turbo Cache, but these reboots started to happen just exactly like they are happening now with an ATIRadeon which hadn't TC and had a 128bit memory interface.
This new GT one also have no TC and has a 128bit interface, so I am guessing that either the motherboard as a whole has a really serious issue with this kind of GCards, or simply the BIOS/CMOS is outdated and needs to be flashed.

Of course, I won't update myself, since I don't trust the power here (since my mom sometimes forgets there are PCs on and by turning an extra machine when there is already another running... you know what I am talkign about LOL), and also since it seems that I need to burn a disk and I don't have any driver for it. So I will have to get my PC to the store AGAIN, and see if they update the BIOS or find out the true problem. I prefer to be the BIOS or a motherboard design flaw, because this way I get everything working again in the same day, but in case the mobo died somewhere (which I really start to doubt since it only reboots at certain specific programs and websites), I am screwed for a month or more.

So what do you think? Still a screwed mobo, or just a CMOS/BIOS waiting to be updated/flashed?

I also made all sort of tests to viruses, but since I reinstalled windows it still happens.

System Specs:
CPU: Intel Dual-Core E2160 (1,8 GHz)
RAM: 2x1024Mb DDR2
Mobo: ASUS P5PL2-E
GCards: My ASUS nVidia 7300GS fried, so they gave me an ATI Radeon (where the restarts started) then yesterday they gave me a new one, which I am currently using: nVidia 7300GT Silent
HDs: 160Gb SATA (3 partitions) + 160Gb IDE
OS: Windows XP Pro SP2
PSU: 450W


EDIT: It started to reboot at forums sites as well with FireFox. Going to use IE only for now to see what happens.

[Myth]

These things are the most annoying things about PCs.

So there are only problems while you browse websites whit firefox? And only some sites? My guess is that the problem is whit Java or JavaScript or maybe flash... try disabling them and see if it helps.

I assume that you use Windows XP, but it should be similar any other windows.
Also right click on MyComputer => Properties => Advanced => Startup and Recovery
There are some things about system failure. Disable auto restart and try to as much debug info as you can. It should be easier to solve the problem.

ALWAYS UPDATE DRIVERS. But if latest don't work properly try older ones. For example my GPU actually runs faster whit older drivers (dunno why). Firefox is known to crash when there are problems whit the graphics driver (especially under win98).

You can always use different web browsers. Firefox, Opera, IE, Safari, Chrome... there are much more options than firefox, even MS-DOS ones, and not to mention the Linux ones.

[Feralidragon]

So there are only problems while you browse websites whit firefox? And only some sites? My guess is that the problem is whit Java or JavaScript or maybe flash... try disabling them and see if it helps.

I assume that you use Windows XP, but it should be similar any other windows.
Also right click on MyComputer => Properties => Advanced => Startup and Recovery
There are some things about system failure. Disable auto restart and try to as much debug info as you can. It should be easier to solve the problem.

ALWAYS UPDATE DRIVERS. But if latest don't work properly try older ones. For example my GPU actually runs faster whit older drivers (dunno why). Firefox is known to crash when there are problems whit the graphics driver (especially under win98).

You can always use different web browsers. Firefox, Opera, IE, Safari, Chrome... there are much more options than firefox, even MS-DOS ones, and not to mention the Linux ones.

I also thought about that, so I disabled Java and JavaScript, but then some sites wouldn't work properlly and some functions didn't work at all in some forums.
EDIT: Even with Java off, it still rebooted.
When I had the other temp GCard (ATI), I tried Chrome (same reboots but not hat often as FireFox), IE8 (reboots again), but I didn't try Opera yet.

But I turned off the auto-restart, the it keeps not giving BSODs at all and keeps doing the same restarts at the same places. Also all my drivers are updated, specially the chipset and graphic ones.

Also, since I am using the IE7 now (since I didn't update nothing yet), I can browse so far all websites and it still didn't reboot at all. But what is strange, is that with FireFox open, even stopped, it can reboot the machine, as long FireFox stays open.
But so my question: it's possible that any flash or java based apllication can really screw with certain GCards, to the point of frequent sudden reboots with no BSODs or events in the log whatsoever?

So far, thanks for the help Myth I will search further Java and Flash about these things (since IE8 and Chrome use them frequently too).

[rohitggarg]

Hey Ferali,

Try to switch to the onboard VGA card if that helps. At times when a card fries itself.. It also takes sm amount of motherboard with it. In your case maybe that section of motherboard may be experiencing memory addressing related problems. It can be a case that u end up in BSOD and the card address also gets screwed. Thus u don't see a BSOD.

I don't know much about the ASUS motherboards but i m sure it must be having an onboard card (coz almost all pcs above PII hav it {i know dis coz i hav also experienced a nice lil PII which i still hav plugged })

Hope that helps!!

[Myth]

But I turned off the auto-restart, the it keeps not giving BSODs at all and keeps doing the same restarts at the same places.

Computers can also restart if a software forces it to so maybe it's a virus. I just remembered, my friend told me a few weeks ago. He had the same problems. It kept restarting for no reason whatsoever. Then he reinstalled/formatted everything and it ran perfectly.

Even if you have an anti virus, it's impossible to avoid these. Some viruses are built to actually avoid certain anti viruses.

I recommend testing your computer by running linux on it. It should prove if it's a hardware problem or some windows or virus problem.
All you need is a USB decvice or a CD. This one's really easy to install and use: http://www.slax.org/get_slax.php And it's very portable. Runs on any decent computer.

PS: Just re-read the specs. Note that Windows XP sp3 has been released ages ago.

[Feralidragon]

@rohitggarg: Thanks for the tip, but my Mobo doesn't have any VGA onboard card. It only has onboard sound and LAN (up to 1Gb).
Also, it seems that these kind of GCards have some problems with their VRAM, and my old card problem was a common one, but they decided to give me a new better one instead lol

@Myth: I also formatted my HD partition, and reinstalled the OS (which was already planned once I received the GCard back or a new one). Also, I installed newer versions of flash and java after I installed FireFox and other browsers. Maybe XP SP2 doesn't support these new versions well?
I just didn't updated to SP3 since I heard about many problems with it from who updated.
But I can try (set a restore point and see what happens)...

EDIT: Also, I have here another similar computer in specs (not mine), with just a series 8 nvidia gcard (8600GS), with the same java and flash updates, with the same OS, and still it doesn't reboot for anything...

[Myth]

Try removing all video and audio acceleration, and see if that helps.
To remove video acceleration open the display properties in control panel => settings => advanced => troubleshoot
To remove audio acceleration open sound and audio devices properties in control panel => speaker settings => advanced => performance

Some of these can also be set from dxdiag, and don't forget to run that too and check for any bugs there.

[Fuzz_Ball]

Sorry, but I only skimmed these responses and I'm thinking it MAY be your motherboard.
Did you look over it closely for blown capacitors?
You know.... the tops are rounded instead of being flat and sometimes some crusty ooze may have spooged out.
Boy, I hate when that happens.

[rohitggarg]

I have another idea ....

May be you can burn a freeware Linux bootable CD and start your PC with that. Then try doing all that stuff. Coz if a unix based system restarts, it puts in a hell lot of stuff in the logs.
That way you can easily check what is the problem. Try DSL as it is very small and lightweight.

[Feralidragon]

Sorry, but I only skimmed these responses and I'm thinking it MAY be your motherboard.
Did you look over it closely for blown capacitors?
You know.... the tops are rounded instead of being flat and sometimes some crusty ooze may have spooged out.
Boy, I hate when that happens.

I can't really see them now, since I can't open the case (warranty until the end of the month lol).
But I don't really think that is a blown capacitor, unless it's one near RAM, since it seems that it's only a problem when running flash in websites (there's a game that my brother found that I used as base test to see if it's solved or not, with drivers updates and such, but so far, no luck).
But I noticed one thing when looking through the air entry for the CPU: my mobo has dual channel support, but it seems that both RAM aren't in the "Dual Channel mode" slots like they were before, and maybe while it's weird, that might be the problem.
I will confirm that today with CPUZ at least.
Also my first PC died due to blown capacitors, but I didn't switch them (although I had the tools and experience on welding electronic parts), since the CPU was also frying, the GCard had some drivers issues with UT and the PSU was also dying, so I bought this new one 2 years ago LOL I still have it, since I have there some working parts: a case fan I bought (and that I might add to my PC after the warranty expires) and a CD/DVD player/recorder.

I have another idea ....

May be you can burn a freeware Linux bootable CD and start your PC with that. Then try doing all that stuff. Coz if a unix based system restarts, it puts in a hell lot of stuff in the logs.
That way you can easily check what is the problem. Try DSL as it is very small and lightweight.

In the case I don't have time to go to the store today, I might do that, although the problem might not appear or appear elsewhere with another different OS, since the hardware management is different, and another OS might not call the same functions that Windows calls to lead the PC to fail.

Also, there is any tool to search "restart/reboots" viruses/worms? And updated one of course. I mean, I scanned all the 4 partitions, but it didn't find anything, so I wanted to make sure with one of those tools. Since I saw some similar problems due to "blaster worms", but in a clean install of Windows? I only formatted the C:\ and F:\ partitions, D:\ and E:\ where I save all my data weren't formatted.

[rohitggarg]

Have heard of one by the name "Hijack This". I have read from the forums that its logs are unbreachable by any of the known viruses in the world. If some unidentified or spurious process is running, it cannot possibly escape its logs. Although it puts in the details of every single task your OS is running but highlights those which seem to be dangerous.

You can try that and post the logs just in case....

[Feralidragon]

Have heard of one by the name "Hijack This". I have read from the forums that its logs are unbreachable by any of the known viruses in the world. If some unidentified or spurious process is running, it cannot possibly escape its logs. Although it puts in the details of every single task your OS is running but highlights those which seem to be dangerous.

You can try that and post the logs just in case....

Placed the results in a forum, waiting for an answer, but I guess it won't be needed.

I followed what Myth said about updating to SP3. I must say it looks like it solved the situation completelly (the online "test game" runs everytime now without any reboot, as FireFox in a whole didn't reboot so far, or games).
But now there's another problem, and it's way too common between all SP3 users: now in online games and in normal 3D games, the system has periodic freezes, like 5 seconds ok, then 1 second freezed, and like this in a fixed period.

I searched about it, and its seems some people fixed it by reinstalling the drivers again, so I want to know if there's already a patch or a any kind of hotfix to solve this situation...

EDIT: Forget it, reinstalled sound and graphics like they said in the forum, and all runs smooth now, and no more random browser reboots so far
I guess there was some sort of bug between the the current hardware, the flash player and Windows itself, and with SP3 everything seems to be fixed so far.
Tomorrow I can be sure if my system is either or not fixed.

[Feralidragon]

Thanks, but it's already solved

The problem was between my new GCard drivers, Windows XP Pro SP2 and the newest flash player. I updated to SP3 and got everything solved, no more reboots so far, and the system is still stable as it was before.