Epic: Future of Unreal Tournament [UT4]

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Wises
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Re: Epic: Future of Unreal Tournament

Post by Wises » Fri May 09, 2014 3:39 am

Ohh you pay alright..

-You pay with your most valuable asset.. (yourself)

-You pay with your Time (away from family / friends etc)

- You pay your own Travel.. in some cases extensively

- if you have kids , Daycare fee's..

Anywayz... if you spent $240 developing a mod that every server wanted needed
You could easily recoup your expenses and a lot more.

Ie; nake a gane for pc better then FlappyBird...

Put on steam for $5.00..

Now.. if only 10,765 people buy your game..

How much ... do you make from your Job.. ;)

...

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Re: Epic: Future of Unreal Tournament

Post by papercoffee » Fri May 09, 2014 3:44 am

This ridicules ...earning money for living or paying for being able to mod or map for a game is something totally different.

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Wises
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Re: Epic: Future of Unreal Tournament

Post by Wises » Fri May 09, 2014 4:13 am

Yes well...

The above was more so to do with making full games.. not working on one game
In particular .. UT.

The licensing etc may differ for this.. idk.

For FREE though we can express our ideas/queries/pros/cons/concepts..

https://www.unrealengine.com/blog/the-f ... gins-today

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Re: Epic: Future of Unreal Tournament

Post by UT99.org » Fri May 09, 2014 5:13 am

billybill wrote:I think I'll play it but not subscribe, the sad part is most of us write stuff for UT with no thought of financial gain. I have my doubts about "letting the community decide", I see things all the time that are upvoted on reddit or trending on twitter that are no doubt pushed along by robots. It's pretty much fact now that twitter accounts are massive armies of robots. So the main coders will likely be the ones paying, and main ones listened to will be the few with enough robots. There is some flaws with all of that, but maybe if they get some matchmaking system out there early they can look at stats, replays and rankings and do some comparison before making 'balance' updates. They mention it will be on-going so yeah a lot of possibilities. And expect more live streams like that before the beta clients are out

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Re: Epic: Future of Unreal Tournament

Post by UnrealGGecko » Fri May 09, 2014 10:15 am

Michael is back (Alex posted there as well)!!!
https://forums.unrealengine.com/showthr ... 828-Music-(Original-Unreal-UT-Composer
Remember people, if UT4 won't be your cup of coffee, than UT99 is still waiting for you with open arms. I'll still be here...









come back! :(

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Re: Epic: Future of Unreal Tournament

Post by Feralidragon » Fri May 09, 2014 11:48 am

I watched the stream, and this is by far better than I expected. Lately Epic has been doing incredibly good moves, first with the engine itself, now this.
I won't contribute to it though (at least for now) since for development purposes they pretty much require you to pay for a 20$ license *and* a good enough machine to develop with. I don't plan to pay for something I won't use for now, and my machine is just not good enough to run UE4.

For the ones wondering, the coding language is C++, but BluePrint is supposed to be the "UScript replacement" since it's supposed to be able to do most of what mod makers do anyway, so I guess whoever finds C++ to be hard, can always try BluePrint.

As for paying to develop, that's not a new concept. Epic is actually simplifying it by "if you pay, not only you can help out building UT, you can do anything you want with the engine, sky's the limit". Epic has to win money with all of this somehow, and this seems a more than fair way to do it imho (along the "revenue share" they get from selling of mods and maps). I wouldn't mind paying the 20$ myself if I had the time and machine to help them out with the new UT, or to at least make a mod for it.

As for this market place for mods/maps, great idea as well. With that one, maybe later on even a NW4 would come to light, although I am not sure if it would be by my hand or someone else doing it or me and a whole team.
I can't wait to see what comes out of this in the upcoming years, this new UT could effectively replace the entire series if done properly imho.

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Re: Epic: Future of Unreal Tournament

Post by Hellkeeper » Fri May 09, 2014 12:04 pm

UnrealGecko wrote: UT99 is still waiting for you with open arms. I'll still be here...
We'll all be. Don't worry.

I have to agree with feralidragon on one thing: I don't like Epic's recent games and the prospect of a new UT is not something I am to fond of, but I must admit these guys have been pretty awesome in dealing with their players, mod makers and content creators. I hope they succeed and more companies take inspiration from them.
You must construct additional pylons.

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Re: Epic: Future of Unreal Tournament

Post by papercoffee » Fri May 09, 2014 4:56 pm

I didn't understand a slightest bit of this technical jargon ...I came into channel late and got only the "String Theory" explained :noidea
Feralidragon wrote: As for paying to develop, that's not a new concept. Epic is actually simplifying it by "if you pay, not only you can help out building UT, you can do anything you want with the engine, sky's the limit". Epic has to win money with all of this somehow, and this seems a more than fair way to do it imho (along the "revenue share" they get from selling of mods and maps). I wouldn't mind paying the 20$ myself if I had the time and machine to help them out with the new UT, or to at least make a mod for it.

As for this market place for mods/maps, great idea as well. With that one, maybe later on even a NW4 would come to light, although I am not sure if it would be by my hand or someone else doing it or me and a whole team.
I can't wait to see what comes out of this in the upcoming years, this new UT could effectively replace the entire series if done properly imho.
So ...do I understand this correct ...you pay for making the game? And you pay afterwards to create additional content?
And Epic will also withheld a fee on the additional content?

THIS IS BULLSHIT!
Epic has absolutely no risk in this project, It will be a totally win win scenario for them.
This is like you pay money to get into an internship. WTF??

UT99.org

Re: Epic: Future of Unreal Tournament

Post by UT99.org » Fri May 09, 2014 5:20 pm

billybill wrote:I'm not phased a whole lot by that since I had nothing to start with they are not taking anything from me, would've been worse if the beta was free then they said they would release the game with $20/month subsription for the online service. In this case the game itself is free, modders like us would be more interested in playing the game than making mods etc.

They left promising statements on UEngine1 source code being released.

It annoys me that I still can't buy Postal 2 in my country, we even take it a step further and I've read many times that "possession" of the game is punishable. It was pulled from steam recently because someone obviously told them that a local ban was made 9-10 years ago. That means I cannot even host a copy of the FreeMultiPlayer download on a server located locally, and not even a game server. If UEngine1 was released and they pretty much put the source of the game up in it's raw form wouldn't things be different, maybe? I imagine I could find a loophole somewhere. Note that this would apply to UT99 in Germany as well, although I can't see your laws cares a whole lot about "possession" of the game, only sales and import, maybe I'm wrong. It's weird that there are so many UT servers hosted in Germany though so I guess they don't care about this, free digital distribution etc. Hosting a server is surely the easiest way to get caught for possession?

(And here I was criticizing what happened with the south park game recently. Postal 2 is only as violent as the player wants to be, yet we play movies like the SAW series in the cinema. These guys in govt know what's best for us of course. Is that Socialism?, Well whatever it is, we need less stupid censorship/laws like this)

I love this engine, these restrictions are ridiculous. God I'd love Epic to lawsuit these govts. Especially if there are people getting punished by these laws financially or jail terms, although they are being punished by not having access. I know this has 0% chance of happening until someone does get punished. And no I don't endorse someone mass importing, but should the case arise I would hope the UEngine1/ut99 community and Epic would take some action

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Re: Epic: Future of Unreal Tournament

Post by Janssen » Fri May 09, 2014 6:21 pm

I won't be content because i can envision what the next "UT" should look like...

A mix between FPS and MMORPG. I'm not sure something like that exists.

WoW clones are just that, WoW clones.

But take a realm like UT which is now usually small maps.. and give it a wide WoW-like environment, and levels, and experience, and monsters to kill using MH strategy... monsters of varying levels and skills, with areas differently themed...

And then add all the mods you've seen in UT. For example, some items could only be obtained by doing bunny tracks... or some small areas could be bunny track areas.

Instead of using horses like in WoW, strangelove could be used to fly around.

And so on.

Same weapons as UT99, same mods, in a wide environment...

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Re: Epic: Future of Unreal Tournament

Post by Tobibrocki » Fri May 09, 2014 6:38 pm

billybill wrote: They left promising statements on UEngine1 source code being released.
Do you have a link to one of them? If not, can you maybe remember when and what exactly they said regarding UE1?

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Re: Epic: Future of Unreal Tournament

Post by Gunner » Fri May 09, 2014 6:43 pm

papercoffee wrote:I didn't understand a slightest bit of this technical jargon ...I came into channel late and got only the "String Theory" explained :noidea


So ...do I understand this correct ...you pay for making the game? And you pay afterwards to create additional content?
And Epic will also withheld a fee on the additional content?

THIS IS BULLSHIT!
Epic has absolutely no risk in this project, It will be a totally win win scenario for them.
This is like you pay money to get into an internship. WTF??
I am hoping they will introduce a UT license specific to producing content for Unreal Tournament that is maybe a one time fee or free for non commercial development. If they wanted to keep a subscription, at least lower the price a lot. $20 is way too much.
Tobibrocki wrote:
billybill wrote: They left promising statements on UEngine1 source code being released.
Do you have a link to one of them? If not, can you maybe remember when and what exactly they said regarding UE1?
I remember they said that there is a good chance it will be released to the public. However, UE2+ won't be released due to third party code.
Image

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Re: Epic: Future of Unreal Tournament

Post by Janssen » Fri May 09, 2014 6:59 pm

If they release UT1 code... i'm tempted to look into the idea of making an UT:MMORPG game based on UT1 dynamics.

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Re: Epic: Future of Unreal Tournament

Post by Tobibrocki » Fri May 09, 2014 7:10 pm

Thanks Gunner, it would be cool if it were to get released, imagine the UT99 community (or anybody really that has the skill to do it) taking the engine and putting it through some much needed modernization procedure, stripping it from its limitations and really opening it up for the future. For example adding native multicore support, fixing bugs, new lighting effects and just so much more. Kinda like what ioquake has done with the Quake 3 Engine, except that I think they didn't add much new stuff into it.
Apart from that, it would give Indie Devs a new Engine to build games with as well and everyone could benefit from improvements they would make to it. The engine would evolve beyond what it is right now, wouldn't that be great to have more possibilities with it in the end?
I hope Epic does release it at some point.

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Re: Epic: Future of Unreal Tournament

Post by Feralidragon » Fri May 09, 2014 7:37 pm

@Paper: It's not a win-win situation. The fact that Epic has to manage a forum and the community, manage the marketplace, give their input, do plenty of things also themselves, it's not something I would consider "win-win" at all, they are literally spending part of their working time for this, time that has to be paid as well somehow.
It's going from C person doing just X and Y to also do Z on top of it, time they could use for anything else more profitable if you think about it.
That's what actually impresses me the most, they are trying to do something new never tried before at this scale, and it is actually a risk for them.
On top of that, if you check the history of modding, you will see that most people do not finish what they started, either due a sudden lack of time or lack of motivation or interest, or even other reasons, so the risk is even bigger than this since the moment they have someone in the community working in any key part of UT, they get dependent on this person and his/her whim, making it the kind of risk you never have in an enclosed studio working with professionals instead.
The more time they take in releasing a first version of the game, the more money they will have to invest in the process until the marketplace opens.

Furthermore, you only pay to get access to the *full*, I repeat, !!*FULL*!! Unreal Engine 4 editor and source code *to do whatever you want*, I repeat: to do whatever you want. Up until UE4, developers could only dream of having any of the engine versions in their hands since it cost so much and the policy around it was so tight.
The fact that you can help develop UT with it is just a bonus, not the real intrinsic cost of it.

So honestly, I don't know what people have to complain about it, specially considering that the development of UE4 was started several years ago, and they're pretty much giving it away after years of hard work, and they're giving the opportunity to the community to produce the game they wanted to see developed to begin with, and officially support it with their own money first before actually making revenue from mods (since even so the game has to have a release first for the marketplace of mods to even be able to worth something, and they know this).
Tobibrocki wrote: [...]
Apart from that, it would give Indie Devs a new Engine to build games with as well and everyone could benefit from improvements they would make to it. [...]
Well, considering the existing engines nowadays (like Unity, highly used by indie devs), I don't think that anything done using UE1 as base will ever be even close to top them. Still, it would be interesting to see what people come up with if that happens.

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