Which anti-cheat is up to date ?

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sektor2111
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Re: Which anti-cheat is up to date ?

Post by sektor2111 » Sun Jul 05, 2015 7:37 am

SC]-[LONG_{HoF} wrote: I would be interested to see if you could performed some of those tests you posted on one of my UT99 servers. Be curious to see the results. PM me know if you'd need any admin access to do so.
Anyone can do them without being admin, as shown by Higor and explained at Wiki input command INJECT USERFLAG 1, capture screen, INJECT USERFLAG 0.

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Re: Which anti-cheat is up to date ?

Post by SC]-[WARTZ_{HoF} » Sun Jul 05, 2015 3:32 pm

Thanks for the info. I'll post my findings asap.

Edit:
Rental {HoF} MH#1
Image

Home {HoF} MH#2
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Re: Which anti-cheat is up to date ?

Post by RocketJedi » Wed Jul 08, 2015 8:10 pm

SC]-[LONG_{HoF} wrote:Yeah..... Nelsona.... Don't waste your time with Qwerty. Qwerty thinks he knows everything about running UT99 game servers(true Qwerty knows nothing about coding so yes pointless to debate for sure). I've been running UT servers longer than Qwerty and I'm still learning new things regarding UT99.

Anyways not to go to far off topic.....I just hope Anth gets back into action with developing ACE.

really when as your first UT server? 2003 2004? I know more than you that's for sure.. anyway I was confusing newnet with lcweapons .. lcweapons is the one I don't like. back on topic troll

oh p.s m not the only one who sets for modern times and settings

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Re: Which anti-cheat is up to date ?

Post by sektor2111 » Wed Jul 08, 2015 8:57 pm

Qwerty wrote:oh p.s m not the only one who sets for modern times and setting
I don't get what modern settings are we debating here. Let's take a look around.
I see you using 25 Tickrate (or false reported ? I don't think so)
HOF using 20 and 35
Good...
And now, You have around 0.6 time for processing actor, HOF seems to have 0.2-0.4. HOF's servers seems to be with less stress, so player at HOF runs a bit smoother. This is simple truth, and you speak about players with NASA type machines for compensation of hard load in server ? It's funny. I'm gonna start my Athlon 1800+ then :mrgreen: I'm sorry for PIII, is damaged...

Modern times ? It's interesting - topic might be split or not I'm not in charge anyway...
With the same 4 (four actors) touchers in UT's system for many classes ? With a 32 Bit engine ? With stupid ROLE_DumbProxy in some projectiles and bNetTemporary=True. With only 1023 Network channels messing up things - WARP somehow ? With actors never replicated to client for saving bandwidth or deliberated left bugged ? About what modern times are we speaking ? BotPack.DeathMatchPlus ? Botpack.CTFGame ? These are modern ? I think they were used in firsts days, right ? C'mon let's slow down these jokes with Modern times because kids will start laughing. It's just UT'99 and IT IS NOT READY for modern times - proved already... a powerful CPU will help several things but NOT MAIN structure :lol2: .
MultiCore issues, Graphical issues, Sound issues, all BASED on HardWare too new for UT'99. Credits goes to people working to hack/recode main files in order to make a game playable else UT'99 will go to WC in modern times without "tools". Probably if you look at Q3v1.2 mod will see author testing game in 1024×768 (this is monitor - enough cute) for UT'99.
We can close this speech against P4 and aliases PCs, because they don't have 20 years old - so to speak are newer than UT'99 having smoother playability and... blue screen happened only in that so called UTv3 else my PC is not familiarized yet with Blue Screens, I repeat I won't change anything as long as things works flawless for me.
Last edited by sektor2111 on Sat Feb 27, 2016 11:07 am, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Which anti-cheat is up to date ?

Post by RocketJedi » Thu Jul 09, 2015 3:23 am

I respect your opinion, although I'm not really sure what you going on about, but I will stop the debate now. Just to clarify.. There is no false reporting as you say it. Actually I don't know what you saying.. I think you were on our Monsterhunt server which runs a low tic rate of 25 due to the fact that monsterhunt and nw3 are very taxing on the game engine. our Rocket x server runs tic rate 35. Id like to see how well your machine performs on our RX server with a full load. im happy you don't get blue screens .. I don't know many people with moderns systems who actually get them anymore so I guess your lucky. no one is telling you to buy a new computer most people upgrade their systems to stay with the times not just for UT99 new video cards new processors internet websites much more demanding. Of course to play newer games. I Can understand if you cant afford to upgrade that's cool. no judgment here. for the majority of internet users who have updated their machines usually every 3-5 years (not 20) they play on modern server settings. That's all im trying to say. trust me I loved ut99 on my p4 until I got dual core and now quad core systems with windows 7,8 and soon 10

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Re: Which anti-cheat is up to date ?

Post by Mar » Fri Jul 10, 2015 7:25 pm

Isn't it unfair to compare a Nali weapons MH server with a Normal Weapons Monsterhunt server (or vanilla server)?
Nali weapons is really awesome and goes for eye candy, which therefore will use more resources. (And even more with the NW3 Gore)

----
Also a question: Shouldn't that test for server should be done on the same map for all? Some MH maps includes some bad coded mods which affects just current map.

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Re: Which anti-cheat is up to date ?

Post by sektor2111 » Fri Jul 10, 2015 7:47 pm

Mar wrote:Shouldn't that test for server should be done on the same map for all? Some MH maps includes some bad coded mods which affects just current map.
Cough, I was almost to lose my breath... Gah, some day I'll promise that I'll waste some time to count tweaks operated into a common MH mutator (or in a mine one) added in purpose ONLY to fix problems without to add anything. Other "cute" things from Levels are simply sort of Devils, nobody did something an anti-cheat like (btw) but a lot of useless non-mapping related things are there doing funky unexpected "features" like crashes, stuck, spam, and so on.
A test in the same map will show some small differences anyway (server's CPU power, timers, network, etc) or... very tiny differences as long as ENGINE is the same - probably faster than for the rest due to XC_Engine used.
As for NWIII, this is a server-load for sure, so at this point won't match with a simple one or a speed-hunter one.

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Re: Which anti-cheat is up to date ?

Post by TruthAlwaysEmerges » Sat Feb 27, 2016 10:11 am

I see many interesting posts since my last visit here.
Some said that PC may be not enough powerful for online UT, or connection. I upgraded recently - from 2x2.7 GHz 2 GB RAM to 4x4GHz 4GB RAM. Graphic cards are same - one is 1 GB GF240, on which UT3 works well with everything set on max, other is ATI HD2600XT with 256MB - still too good for UT - getting over 200 fps on many maps in full HD.
Must say that online playing is nothing better than with older config. Actually, connection got even worse - for instance on mentioned Mokum. So, we can be sure that limiting factor is my Internet connection, precisely provider Deutsche Telekom. I can play pretty well when there is no much player on map. When there is more - like 6+ then it just starts to be like shooting with blanks. Or if there is only couple, very active player, who make high traffic on connection. To add that I just can not do some frequent movements, sometimes even simple doublejump works not, or must repeat it multiple times, then picking up weapons - need to repeat pass over ... All mentioned is explainable only this way: packet number in time is limited. And most of servers does some checks all time during match - I was kicked several times in middle of game because time-out during checks. Then, some even worse things: I see standing bot - shoot it once - nothing, again - nothing , etc. It is just that bot is not really there (for server), only on my PC is there. So, error in communication, missed packet(s). Even worse - shoot rockets, than running in that direction - and I was killed by my own rockets :mrgreen: - so packet order in time is changed, and some have big delay.
All in all, I can blame only Telekom for that. But I can not go other provider without changing my street address, so without moving. Current speed is 30 Mb/sec, and it is true 100% - can DL at it any time practically.
Next my post will be about cheating, again, with some new things.

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Re: Which anti-cheat is up to date ?

Post by sektor2111 » Sat Feb 27, 2016 11:03 am

I have UPC cable - the speed is as they said. Of course, were random problems a couple of months ago and rarely still happens.
In evening, at certain hour Internet was using to go down for 3 seconds repeating this way several times and then returning to normal. When I had some connections (downloads, gaming, etc) this was happening a little often. In this way I cannot sustain any server from home because I'm not interested in doing trashes to bug people. When all player was on full party RED-FLAG tuned everything into garbage. I can say that happened very rare on old DSL line - yes, that low speed connection was 50 times more stable than this "fast" cable which I'm currently using. So to speak DSL was out 3 times in 4 years due to weather problems and other ISP big issues. That's it, I won't pay a fortune for a Fiber-Link as long as this will require more hardware changes which I'm not interested to do, so to speak throwing money on window is not an option for me.

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Re: Which anti-cheat is up to date ?

Post by $carface » Sat Feb 27, 2016 2:17 pm

Mar wrote:Isn't it unfair to compare a Nali weapons MH server with a Normal Weapons Monsterhunt server (or vanilla server)?
Nali weapons is really awesome and goes for eye candy, which therefore will use more resources. (And even more with the NW3 Gore)

----
Also a question: Shouldn't that test for server should be done on the same map for all? Some MH maps includes some bad coded mods which affects just current map.
The serverside penalty for running different weapon packs wouldn't be that much of a marker really. Ferali knew what he was doing so I doubt he would have coded inefficiently. The penalty would be at client side. Not serverside.
Qwerty wrote:not a fan of newnet.. we run zp103. with your pc specs and bad internet connection yeah your gonna have a bad time playing. most ut servers and I know the =(V)= servers are configured for decent pc's and a decent connection. if your still playing on a P4 with just hyperthreading everyone is going to seem faster. I cant even imagine what video card you are running. I bet you warp all over the place.
Qwerty wrote:no I'm not wrong. like I said before which I guess you couldn't understand is "MOST SERVERS" are configured for "higher netspeed and Tic rates".
Qwerty wrote:yes ut can run on dial up modems and Pentium 4 but WILL NOT RUN well on your 20 year old system unlnes you join 20 tic 6000 netspeed servers which no one runs. as I said OUR SERVERS are set for higher tic rates and higher netspeeds so if you joined my server you wouldn't even be able to play like the rest of us who use modern systems

Qwerty wrote:edit: play ut with a modern system and I bet you wouldn't ever want to go back to your Pentium 4. i'm sorry you are still on that ancient platform


Wow, WTF did I just read.

You seriously need to stop thinking that you know everything. Stop talking out of your ass. You know, Sektorka knows way more than you do. That's why he knows he doesn't need an expensive computer to run UT. He can go and buy a 5$ PC and it will run UT. It's your lack of knowledge that prevents you from doing so.

This is the minimum spec for UT
Minimum system requirements:
CPU: Intel Pentium 200MHz or AMD K6 200MHz
RAM: 32MB RAM
GPU: PCI Local Bus Video Card
OS: Windows 95/98/2000/Windows NT 4.0/Linux/Mac
Store: 300MB
Sound: DirectX 7.0 Compatible Sound Card
Network: TCP/IP (28.8K minimum speed)

Anyone with a pea sized brain, which you seem to lack, will know not to listen to you :noidea

UT is a single threaded process, therefore having these i7s does squat all. In fact, the main thing you can do to enhance your UT experience is buy a CPU that is strong on single core performance, something like a 3770k or a 4770k are amongst the strongest of contenders. In any case, UT is designed to run on older technology. Therefore, if you purchase an older technology computer, it will naturally do well. Tickrate of a measly 25 and 35 has nothing to do with client side stability. Nor does netspeed. It simply dictates how regularly the client receives an update. I run all my servers at double the value you quote and guess what? We have people using Intel Celerons @ 150mhz and they play without any complaints.

inject userflag is a good bench and it shows that hof's setup = less stressed setup and therefore, it's a better setup than yours. Like I said in my other post, you have squat all knowledge of how to do things properly. You "had" or claim that you had a popular BT server. Wanna know why everyone plays on my server, that I couldn't give a rats ass about? Because it's a better setup. Don't tempt me to setup a better RX server :satan:

Stop humiliating yourself you moron.

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Re: Which anti-cheat is up to date ?

Post by TruthAlwaysEmerges » Sat Feb 27, 2016 3:51 pm

Back to topic - cheats.
Before that something little related with computer speeds: some players with very fast movement claim that it is because their strong computer - one said that has 16 GHz CPU - when I laughed, said it is 4x4GHz. I said that UT is single core, and he said that I know nothing .... and similar shit :D
What I see at moment, as most used cheat on Deathmach and CTF is speed hack. Dodgebot is next, and some weird Russian cheats, where they do crazy things beside speed - like instant kill with hammer - you don't see anything, just falling dead. Of course, everyone can do speed hack with Cheat Engine for instance - it's principle is quite simple - changing PC's system clock, so SW will do everything faster, because is based on system clock. I did something similar long time ago - fooled timer for DOS game Block Out, so could score much more. That was only for experiment and proving that it should work. But most of servers will detect too fast running and kick user, or just slow down him or put back. However, redeemers, rockets fly much faster too, and that's big advantage. Server just can not check everything for all users all time. But that would be only way.
If everything would be under server control, and today computers could do that with ease lot of cheats would not work. So, whole concept of UT99 is not good for this days.
Of course, something can not be under control/test - user's actions - not possible to see by SW is he so good aimer or it is aimbot. I guess that anti-cheats just try to find aimbot code in client computer.
All in all, UT-s opened design allowed nice add-ons, but is very good for cheats too.

Some examples - what I seen today: player with nick M (former TT most likely) does instant and large dodges - you just see he is in mS on other loc. Then some do extremely large dodges, 5x-10x longer than normal - very useful on Buddah funnel for instance. Please don't come with "no names allowed without proof and like". Instead it visit Funnel.de server and look what goes on there. You don't need diploma from atom physics to see things. That server is practically destroyed by cheat, especially during weekend. I expect that will be down soon. As is down interest of many people to play UT at all online anymore.

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Re: Which anti-cheat is up to date ?

Post by Mar » Sat Feb 27, 2016 5:07 pm

$carface wrote:
Mar wrote:Isn't it unfair to compare a Nali weapons MH server with a Normal Weapons Monsterhunt server (or vanilla server)?
Nali weapons is really awesome and goes for eye candy, which therefore will use more resources. (And even more with the NW3 Gore)
----
Also a question: Shouldn't that test for server should be done on the same map for all? Some MH maps includes some bad coded mods which affects just current map.
The serverside penalty for running different weapon packs wouldn't be that much of a marker really. Ferali knew what he was doing so I doubt he would have coded inefficiently. The penalty would be at client side. Not serverside.
It is not much but still should be considered. Ferali did an amazing job so the mod could run the best it can on this old engine. I am happy the way it is now the mod.
---

But I really believe that those test should be on the same Map, as in MH there are really nasty maps :/

Map: MH-InsectHell (this map got lots of errors on log)
Test1
Show
With NW3
Shot0073.png
Without NW3
Shot0075.png
Map: MH-(MHA)-crazyisland2012ultimate (Not much errors lol, dont remember a map without errors sorry)
Test2
Show
With NW3
Shot0083.png
Without NW3
Shot0081.png
$carface wrote:UT is a single threaded process, therefore having these i7s does squat all. In fact, the main thing you can do to enhance your UT experience is buy a CPU that is strong on single core performance, something like a 3770k or a 4770k are amongst the strongest of contenders. In any case, UT is designed to run on older technology. Therefore, if you purchase an older technology computer, it will naturally do well. Tickrate of a measly 25 and 35 has nothing to do with client side stability. Nor does netspeed. It simply dictates how regularly the client receives an update. I run all my servers at double the value you quote and guess what? We have people using Intel Celerons @ 150mhz and they play without any complaints.
I agree, although in RX/SLV tickrate can affect a lot, since jets update position every tick. (If I remember correctly)


Sorry for the offtopic again :/
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Re: Which anti-cheat is up to date ?

Post by sektor2111 » Sat Feb 27, 2016 5:34 pm

Actually I was trying to point out "options":
- high loaded map + high loaded Mod = NON UT GAME = server under-resourced blaming player;
- easy map + easy mod = UT GAME = server able to run on a PIII;

Problem of MH is not Level itself as much is setup and Stuff used - NOT TESTED and NOT DONE for monsters it's just Mapper's LULU trying to gain popularity, but clueless about stuff added - end of story.
The rest of MH stuff is: Badly rotated brushes, NO zoning, No proper Mover setup, No f...g idea about "MyLeveling" good stuff - enjoy also bytes having "#%//&" values and timers with values bigger than a line written on A4 paper with small letters + purposedly added bad stuff, or just... 0 stuff to encourage a 0 skill full weaponry load.

Aside: I'm not considering those Levels MH Maps.

Admin has no resources: Hey, player, please upgrade your PC !
Player: WHAT !!?? :shock: ? A 16 years old game needs a new PC ??? Get lost, Mr... I know this game since I was playing it on my PIII, what the heck is wrong with you ? I want UT, so I play UT using a machine for UT. The rest of "News" don't even look like UT.

Topic Anti-Cheat
May I tell you the truth ? Share with other admins some occurrences found. When evidences are clear just firewall all turd's zone at least for 6 months until idiot will learn to play as a normal human being based on normal human reflexes and sensors not boosted as a retarded A.I. creature which I'm using as opponents, LOL, pushed in combat to not sleep.
Suggestions ?
Yes ? You can setup a web page or a forum with having posted public cheaters IPs. Then we can build properly some list, we add that one in main firewall - good night in advance. Even in EULA cheating is forbidden, so you don't have to feel sorry about cheaters.

And the magic: If this list is added in firewall at Master-Server for sure they won't see any server for playing ON-LINE so they can enjoy their crap OFF-LINE without disturbing players.

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Re: Which anti-cheat is up to date ?

Post by Barbie » Wed Mar 02, 2016 1:24 pm

TruthAlwaysEmerges wrote:All in all, I can blame only Telekom for that
In earlier days there were an option FastPath. If this still exists with your connection type, enabling it could reduce the latency. Just an idea.
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Re: Which anti-cheat is up to date ?

Post by MrLoathsome » Wed Mar 02, 2016 10:16 pm

There is indeed still a Fastpath option, but I think it is just for DSL lines. (Might be wrong about that detail...)
It does indeed reduce the lag a bit.

I had to contact the support techs at AT&T to get this enabled again after their last update.
Option has to be set at their end. The DSL modem/router they provide has no way to adjust that setting.

Re: Machine speeds.

If you can't run UT on a P3, let alone a HT P4, you are doing it wrong.
Probably at many levels.
blarg