[solved] Getting Bots to Jump slime onto platform.

[Que]

so i was having difficulties getting bots to jump between 128uu platforms to get over slime;



the problem was that the apples couldn't see each other across the gaps.

to counter this I gave them a radius of 100 and made sure that they overlapped each other in Radii View;







Now Bots Jump Happily over the Slime to get to the Shield-Belt on the center platform



DM-011;

[Buggie]

From what I see on picture above - there no return path back. So bots trapped here and will be wandering forever on this island.
Possible there need use lift combo.

[Que]

for some reason the collision radius does not matter mybad.
had issues with another map where bots refused to jump slime.
in these 2 maps they bounce around all over the place. from platform to platform over and over again.

[sektor2111]

There is no difficulty for making Bot to jump somewhere. Always combos LE-LC-LE or LE-PP-LE - and now days there are other solutions which I already described multiple times. What you need there is called ReachSpec known as Path not collisions. Sometimes they will get connected by Goblin over small holes if are placed away from ledges.
Edit:
Number11 was already connected exactly because of previous posted sentence - AWAY from ledges.

And later I got this - Using Editor and nothing else...

I think you can get them connected too right here...

DM-011a.7z

(7.39 KiB) Downloaded 3 times

Too easy ! It's really too easy...
The rest means that PathNodes were not touched at collisions but... LOWERED, he he

[Que]

There is no difficulty for making Bot to jump somewhere. Always combos LE-LC-LE or LE-PP-LE - and now days there are other solutions which I already described multiple times.

What other methods sektor?
Also what is LE-LC-LE & LE-PP-LE , are they?
LE = LiftExit
LC=Lift enter
PP=?

What you need there is called ReachSpec known as Path not collisions. Sometimes they will get connected by Goblin over small holes if are placed away from ledges.

How do we manually? Control reachspecs?

Have also discovered the max distance between platforms before paths won't connect.. this is 144uu.. (128+16).

^ This is at 160uu.. (144+16).
Paths from outer Limits will not connect to inside platform.. will now try LE-LC-LE

ok Have tried LE-LC-LE (with no ImpactHammer Jump) and Bots are able to Jump 160uu Gaps



Again for testing , use 1 or 2 bots and spectator mode (there's 2 PlayerStarts)
UDamage is on a 20 second respawn-time & Charge of 150.

[sektor2111]

PP is PainPath - a sort of LiftCenter and I see less code involved.

How do we manually? Control reachspecs?

Manual means using XC assets - in Editor are not damaging anything. Either way these paths are linked if Nodes are once again, AWAY from LEDGES. Just see my sample - rebuild paths. Usually I have to pick one of options which I described often - it's not like people are interested.
Stock solutions:
#1 Put nodes away - might get connected
#2 Using Combos
#3 Using Fake Water zones temporary - Nodes in water are connected in any direction. Here are generated R_Swim paths, but they are not a problem for Bots because a Bot can swim after all.
Community assets:
#4 Fake Teleporters
#5 Fake Warps
The rest
#6 Demand a jumper ReachSpec or two or how many are needed with XC_PathsWorker. Here you really can connect what you want and how you want.
The problem here comes that builder is powerful. You need to know what is about with navigation because is really easy to fail. Builder won't ask why do you want that, it will execute what you said. If you ask it something wrong, builder will deliver what you wanted.

I passed the stage when I was building paths and moving nodes for hours in hoping to gain connections. Modify Save Test Game - repeating these X times during X hours - it's history. These are not connected ? Let's get them connected.

Why I'm reading topics with such "issues" ? Because they are inspiring me to add more functions in pathing builder for making things more easy to get handled and reducing the time consumed with polishing.

[Que]

Ahh kk , perhaps higor will look at putting paths builder into 469x would be cool

For now I use LE-LC-LE.

Will look into PainPaths and see what happens.

[sektor2111]

Examination of DM-012c sample.
Here after overcrowding navigation like that you don't even need PathNodes any more. All are connected normally with no issues.
Take a look...

Right now I did even a test for logic connections - full test - all normal...

[Que]

What are you using here sektor?

XC_PathsBuilder?

[sektor2111]

Editor, only Editor.
At this moment I have 3 tools for defining paths:
#1 Editor itself - it's what I used here;
#2 XC_PathsBuilder - embedded with XC_EditorAdds from XC_Engine 24
#3 my XC_PathsWorker - it does paths using UScript with access to natives capable to handle ReachSpecs. This one can modify/move/nulling a path. Nulled paths can be even completely deleted - no junks. Other features:
- testing nodes for potential connections;
- defining any sort of user ReachSpec;
- generating automatically a connection tested between two selected Navigation points - this allows full manual pathing;
- automatic mode has a configuration: Range for connecting, max paths number from a node, size for some bunch of inventories, excepting hidden Nodes and items from being in account, keeping a previous network and there are many options due to methods used - wrapping First/Last does different results for the same placement of nodes. Navigation chain needed can be later linked with MapGarbage (in case of manual pathing) - before linking it you can wrap as First/Last whatever classes you need.
Builder #3 looks operational in 469b too... but it works visible slower - Speaking about "hard-core" tasks.

In your sample I could connect all missing paths but... first I wanted to see "oldskool" methods - it worked. Geometry here is too good and simple, failures are mainly impossible.

[Red_Fist]

You might try putting some in the slime for paths to connect, under water or maybe on top.
depending how wide the gap is. They won't jump in but go for other pickups they want first.

Just an idea.

bad idea, didn't work.

EDIT
Plus I didn't know the water-slime level was much below the walkways like that
I think, especially DM, you should not get trapped like that.

[sektor2111]

It's not needed any uber "engineering", Editor with its ancient DevPath is just linking them normally. I'm tempted to use Editor as first stage. If Editor starts failing Paths, only that is the moment when I'm using alternate solutions - all of them compatible with UT436, is really that simple.
In other cases when I already can predict failures and spots are very complex, I'm going to work manually everything. In the most of not very complex cases XC_PathsBuilder from XC_Engine does a primary task and then I polish junks post-pathing with my builder. I wrote such an automated task recently. Next month will be published. With prior version this "CleanUP" is possible through manual methods.

In order to not suspect me by fake propaganda here are maps. You can "paths undefine" and then "paths define". See visual differences. The only things different are those vars completed with useless data increasing file-size of map and not shown to user-mapper in plain view.

DM-008a_12c1.7z

(14.54 KiB) Downloaded 2 times

Let me know if you want the same things done manually... .